Thank you, Erick. You have stated my thoughts perfectly. This is exactly why I absolutely refuse to tweet or post anything about Sarah Palin. It is a no win situation. And it ought not to be that way. Thanks again.

is exactly what Ziegler is doing by ankle biting Palin. I’m getting tired of these articles that psychoanalyze her every fault, it’s no different than the email trolling. No candidate is perfect.

If he feels that way, just move on, don’t give the other side fodder, it only hurts the movement.

I’m ok with not supporting her, but why undermine her?

Not to mention he’s a little strange. He did some wonderful things for Palin immediately after the 2008 campaign. He has not been terribly consistent for the past year.

And to be honest, Erick, I have a hard time believing that you’d be defending him if he didn’t reach the same conclusion you reached about Palin. Sorry.

You’ve encapsulated one of the major reasons Palin has no business running for – and being – President. For the last two years Palin has let others come to her defense and has completely avoided the media who have on-and-off attacked her. We suffered through this with Bush hiding under the desk in the Oval Office for the last several years of his Presidency, refusing to respond to the attacks and the outright lies from Democrats. And frankly Bush is a mountain of courage compared to Palin who cut and run from the Governor’s office when she got herself cornered.

Best wishes to Ziegler.

Erick… coming to the defense of Ed Rollins… now John Ziegler?

*sigh*

hasn’t been able to monetize his support for Palin and needs to move on. Sounds like a good choice to me.

*is* “eating our own.”

Why give aid and comfort to Katie Couric and her ilk right now?

I am not a Palin fanatic in any sense. I appreciate her for everything she has done in mobilizing the grass roots, and making what seemed impossible to many feel possible. She revved up a sort of animal spirit within the conservative movement after we had been beaten back by Obama and his thugs. She was out there taking on the Obama machine almost from the start while other Republican leaders were trembling in the corner or making gestures toward working with Obama. Of course she did not do all this singlehandedly, but she was very visible. And I am glad she was there. She is like a modern Thomas Paine to me, and putting her in the oval office would detract from the freedom she has to be who she is – faithful and principled opposition, in every sense of the word.

With that said, I take a look around at the politics of the primary and I see a huge disconnect between the treatment of Palin (and we do not know if she is going to run) and the extremely blue guy in the lead that it seems like no one wants to touch. We can’t eat our own (if that guy is even one of our own, it’s hard to tell) we are told, then a swipe at Palin comes flying through.

It makes no sense. It seems like it really is not one of those natural things, not misogyny, but perhaps manufactured for politcal gain. If I’m right about that, it isn’t coming from the left at all – and perhaps we should second guess the scruples of who stands to gain the most from the wholesale destruction of Palin.

I read all four pages of the article. The only reason given for Palin being unable to win that I saw was:

I told her: “You have to know, you can’t beat Obama in 2012. The media won’t let you. They won’t let him lose and the narrative about you is too negative to correct in three-and-a-half years.”

Is that it? Did I miss it… all the other reasons? If so, please point them to me… I’d like to know.

If not… I can ‘solve’ that problem and I think that Palin has as well.

Help?

Working for and with someone and then spilling your guts in a fit of pique is trashy.

The Ziegler piece reads like a 14 year old girl’s diary entry after her beau ideal asked someone else to the big dance.

Everything Ziegler wrote about Mrs. Palin may be 100% accurate, but going public with all the gory details and the childish whining is tacky tacky tacky.

This is nothing but a hit piece. A betrayal of the worst order, designed to hit the news first thing Monday and kneecap Palin just as she is about to overtake Romney. Ziegler is despicable.

…I’m just saying it doesn’t matter a whole lot to me. Whatever “conservatives” might be saying on Twitter (how do you know they are conservatives, anyway?) is not something that matters much, either, as far as forming a rational opinion of anyone who is running for office.

I read the article; I can see what this guy is trying to say. If he truly cared about the GOP’s chances in 2012 he would not be bothering to take such a point of view, and neither would anybody else. He would be concentrating instead on HOW WE CAN DEFEAT OBAMA and his posse of criminals before it’s too late–there’s no other issue of moment here, and nothing else that matters. Whether Sarah Palin runs for president is of no consequence, AS LONG AS OBAMA GETS THE FREAKING GATE. (Is there something really complicated about that? Sometimes I wonder…)

Is any of this rhetoric going to help in the fight against the creeping socialism that has almost overwhelmed us?

If people would stop attacking Gov Palin, it’s likely those who want to stand up for what’s right would stop feeling like they need to defend her. This is just another attempt by another group of otherwise respectable individuals to use Palin’s formidable reputation as a stepping stone; to what, I can’t even begin to guess and I sort of don’t want to know. I would expect more professionalism than that from a publication such as RedState, but then again I guess I don’t know that much about it…?

This all seems like a bunch of Alinskyish mud-stirring to me. I mean, what are you guys so damned scared of, anyway? You can’t dig up any real dirt on her, so you pay people to diss her so you can print it.

I’m really, honestly disappointed in you, Mr. Erickson. I think you have a lot going for you, but you seem to have lost the way somehow.

Check out the wiki on his radio career. One personal disaster after another.

Palin should have vetted “hiim*.

Really not much in a 4 page article that should have been condensed into a few paragraphs.

It’s weird, just the other day I was talking about how it was classless to go after Romney the other day and was told that I was wrong – and now the same people seem to agree with me such as shoes are on other feet.

I didn’t hear the liberal media saying the radical Barack Obama was unelectable in 2008. This argument pushed by George Will, Erick Erickson, Karl Rove, and others is very disturbing. She is right on the issues. Of course she has no shot if the “conservative” media won’t stop going negative on her.

RedState is playing right into the liberal media’s hands. They are promoting the same argument the liberal media is, that she is unelectable.

Instead of articles supporting conservative candidates, we get to hear about how Romney had a great week the same week he embraced man made global warming. Or how Michele Bachman had a great week the same week her advisor trashed Sarah Palin.

This is a very disturbing trend from a so called “conservative” blog.

this article says much more about him than it does Palin. Most definitely, a legitimate case can be made that it would be best for Palin to set 2012 out and wait for better odds. But most of what Ziegler “writes” here (and I use the quotes there because it is incredibly poorly written, and reads more like a bunch of 12-year-old girls’ text messages strung together) are indeed the ramblings of a jilted “lover”.

The base arguments for Palin not running in 2012 could easily be expressed in one 420 character Facebook post. Ziegler’s 4-page tome is just bad writing and detracts from what could have been a legitimate argument.

Palin may be looking at things this way: Let’s say that Perry, for example, wins the nomination and beats Obama. And further, say that he chooses Rubio (or some other fairly young GOP star) as his running mate. This could shut Palin out for 12-16 years, and maybe ultimately make her irrelevant if she doesn’t get some high-profile elected or appointed gig. While 2012 may be her toughest shot, it may also be her best. And, as I’ve said before, campaigns do have a way of changing things. We’ll see.

Well, two things -
1) can anyone explain to me why John Zeigler felt the need to do a very public confessional on why he is not supporting Sarah Palin for President? was he feeling left out? unwanted? is there some narcissism involved here? He thinks he knows politics (even though he has no experience whatsoever in politics) and is upset she did not follow his advice.
2) can we just take a look at the real John Zeigler and see just exactly how he thinks about women… a classic case of John Zeigler for all to enjoy…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQqLPJvk3gM

It took just a few minutes for the usual suspects of (1) Palin-haters to pounce on this saying “see, I told ya so, Ziegler is exactly right, yeh-huh” and (2) Palinistas to attack Ziegler’s article as a “hit-piece”, etc.

Not only that, but this thread is probably gonna have like 10 times more posts than any other thread of the day by the time its all said and done.

You people do realize that not only does Palin NOT hold ANY elected office currently, she is also NOT currently a candidate for ANY elected office whatsoever, right?

What would any of the ACTUAL Presidential candidates give in order to be able to have the very mention of their name completely dominate every political blog and media outlet the way Palin does?

I bet if Palin were to hold a press conference at the same time as the GOP debate where all of the major candidates are participating, not only would all of the networks cover her press conference instead of the debate, but the entire night of political commentary on every channel would be about her and the debate would barely garner a mention.

I personally don’t see her running for the nomination, but I see whoever she endorses winning it, because Sarah’s folks are a pretty good chunk of the GOP base, and they exhibit a level of loyalty to her rarely seen for a figure from the right. Just imagine what her endorsement could do for someone like Romney, who needs help shoring up support from Evangelicals with reservations about his faith and previous statements on abortion.

Is my business. And so are the consequences of it and I don’t really care what others think about it, especially leftists and republican establishments. I should be silenced because it might be convenient for somebody?

Is Zeigler not getting enough attention? Is he being pithy because Todd waited until last month to call him? What chip is he carrying on his shoulder about his supposed ‘loyalty’?

This is BS! The man sets out and says he’s destroyed himself with loyalty for Sarah Palin and then trouts out the idiocy that she can’t be elected, and DEMANDING credibility because he’s been such a ‘loyal’ supporter? Fie on his loyalty. I’ve never seen such a bunch of poor excuses for coming out and writing such a snigglerly snotty article.

And I don’t mind saying so at all!

Is my business. And so are the consequences of it and I don’t really care what others think about it, especially leftists and republican establishments. I should be silenced because it might be convenient for somebody?

Is Zeigler not getting enough attention? Is he being pithy because Todd waited until last month to call him? What chip is he carrying on his shoulder about his supposed ‘loyalty’?

This is BS! The man sets out and says he’s destroyed himself with loyalty for Sarah Palin and then trouts out the idiocy that she can’t be elected, and DEMANDING credibility because he’s been such a ‘loyal’ supporter? Fie on his loyalty. I’ve never seen such a bunch of poor excuses for coming out and writing such a snigglerly snotty article.

And I don’t mind saying so at all!

Is my business. And so are the consequences of it and I don’t really care what others think about it, especially leftists and republican establishments. I should be silenced because it might be convenient for somebody?

Is Zeigler not getting enough attention? Is he being pithy because Todd waited until last month to call him? What chip is he carrying on his shoulder about his supposed ‘loyalty’?

This is BS! The man sets out and says he’s destroyed himself with loyalty for Sarah Palin and then trouts out the idiocy that she can’t be elected, and DEMANDING credibility because he’s been such a ‘loyal’ supporter? Fie on his loyalty. I’ve never seen such a bunch of poor excuses for coming out and writing such a snigglerly snotty article.

And I don’t mind saying so at all!

Is my business. And so are the consequences of it and I don’t really care what others think about it, especially leftists and republican establishments. I should be silenced because it might be convenient for somebody?

Is Zeigler not getting enough attention? Is he being pithy because Todd waited until last month to call him? What chip is he carrying on his shoulder about his supposed ‘loyalty’?

This is BS! The man sets out and says he’s destroyed himself with loyalty for Sarah Palin and then trouts out the idiocy that she can’t be elected, and DEMANDING credibility because he’s been such a ‘loyal’ supporter? Fie on his loyalty. I’ve never seen such a bunch of poor excuses for coming out and writing such a snigglerly snotty article.

And I don’t mind saying so at all!

Is my business. And so are the consequences of it and I don’t really care what others think about it, especially leftists and republican establishments. I should be silenced because it might be convenient for somebody?

Is Zeigler not getting enough attention? Is he being pithy because Todd waited until last month to call him? What chip is he carrying on his shoulder about his supposed ‘loyalty’?

This is BS! The man sets out and says he’s destroyed himself with loyalty for Sarah Palin and then trouts out the idiocy that she can’t be elected, and DEMANDING credibility because he’s been such a ‘loyal’ supporter? Fie on his loyalty. I’ve never seen such a bunch of poor excuses for coming out and writing such a snigglerly snotty article.

And I don’t mind saying so at all!

my post shows up so many times. I don’t see a remove button to get rid of them. Sorry.

my post shows up so many times. I don’t see a remove button to get rid of them. Sorry.

it just reinforces my opinion that no matter how “super awesome” a conservative Palin may be, it’s just not worth all of the drama. I would rather have a conservative leader in a different package, even if what was done to her was completely unfair.

Ziegler definitely comes off like a jilted lover, but I sincerely think he was a true believer that’s honestly worried that a Palin candidacy would basically hand Obama and the Democrats a blank check and destroy the GOP brand, that’s why he’s speaking out now before she goes down that road.

Friend of who?

What’s next her high school classmate who happens to be a conservative but has an axe to grind because Sarah refused to share her chewing gum so we have to take her opinion that Sarah is not fit for the Presidency.

Common, I was expecting a solid debate on policy matters that is grounded on conservative principles.

Red State lost some credibility by promoting a nonsensical whining.

I read the Ziegler article, it was a LOOONG one, but I read it, and I agree with the vast majority of the comments I read, that the guy simply has an extreme case of self-importance. Most of the comments about Governor Palin were favorable, but despite that he feels she can’t win because, according to him, the media won’t let Obama lose, so she shouldn’t run this year. Because, in his mind, she is about to ignore his oh-so-sage advice to wait until Obama’s second term is over to run, the world is ending. The most important point here is that just because Sarah Palin doesn’t agree with your assessment that Obama can’t be beaten because ‘the media won’t let him lose’, that doesn’t mean she doesn’t like you Z-man. It just means she thinks you’re wrong, which I, and I suspect most folks here, do also. It doesn’t mean we don’t respect all the things you’ve done, its just that we aren’t as pessimistic as you. And it’s OK to not agree with somebody on every single issue, especially when its something involving pure conjecture, like who is gonna win the White House, or the Super Bowl, next year.

Maybe the media will succeed in propping Obama up next year, maybe they won’t, but those of us who don’t feel like throwing in the towel just because you have a bad feeling about it aren’t bad people just because we still want to give it a good old college try. So yes, hopefully Sarah Palin is indeed going to reject your advice John, not because she, or I, or anybody else, don’t like you, it’s because we love America, and we don’t believe in going down without a fight, even if the great Ziegler has already decreed the battle is over and Obama has won. I’d rather support Governor Palin as much as I can, watch her do everything she can, and let the chips fall where they may. For the record, I feel pretty good about her chances, I’m pretty confident that if she runs, she wins. I don’t believe the media can prop Obama up a second time, I think he’s done too much damage to the economy, and that whoever wins the GOP nomination will win the general. But we’ll find out whether that’s right or not next year, right now I’m proud to stand with Governor Palin, the Fighter, the Patriot, the Leader.

Well…. John did the documentary, sold some of them, did not make as much money as he thought, was not brought into the inner circle where his great political expertise could be used and has determined that as he toured around the country trying to sell his video that since he could not sell very many that Sarah Palin’s support isn’t as great as people think.

Question…. so John is upset. I just wonder why he had to make such a public display of his displeasure with Sarah… is he narcissistic and upset because this is the only way to get any attention? I don’t understand why he felt it necessary to do this so publically… I see he supports Pawlenty…. I guess since Sarah has not brought him in as her campaign guru, he can farm his expertise out to some of the other candidates… or better yet, he can have a conversion and become the liberal left wing media’s “conservative” panel member on some of their shows… they love turncoats, especially if they smear Sarah.

But, lets look at who else came to Sarah’s defence during all the attacks in 2008, 2009, 2010 and now 2011. Did Eric? Did he? Or was he one of the silent right wing pussies who snickered in the background as the Republican establishment made wisecracks and laughed at the Palin jokes?

Where do you think the Tea Party got its guts from… it sure as hell wasn’t any of the mainstream right wing bloggers.. or the Republican Party… it was from people like Sarah Palin sticking her head out and publicly supporting them and bringing national TV coverage to the rallies and to the first convention… one that all the so-called smart right wingers warned everyone to stay away from. Yet she still went there and all the national networks came and gave the Tea Party national esposure and credibility. It was also sites like C4P, a site that was started simply to defend her from the attacks. And so did many other sites spring up. And when she fought back without much help from the so-called “:conservatives”, she gave the real conservatives out in the boonies the courage to stand up, go to townhalls, raise hell and speak up. It was only after the so-called geniuses on the right couldn’t ignore it any more that they finally, grudgingly accepted it.

So, screw anyone who complains that Sarah Palin supporters are too tough on any criticism…. it is something learned over 3 years… just like Sarah does not trust anyone too much, either do we… and if you try to screw with Sarah, we screw with you. Simple.

And Eric, here is your guy John Zeigler, telling us exactly what he thinks about women… watch to the end for the good stuff… do you think of women the same way Eric since you think John is such a great guy?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lw0KuMaSHZQ

But that won’t make the problems go away.

However justified, her resignation is going to be used against her. It doesn’t matter what the defense is, if she is on defense against Obama, she loses. The problem of her negatives nationally is something her supporters dismiss because at one time Reagan had similar negatives. But Reagan was perceived negatively before he was a familiar national figure, he managed to introduce himself to the electorate and dispel the smoke. Palin’s already known, or at least people and media believe they know her, that is hard to recast.

And the whole image thing created by Tina Fey’s SNL “I can see Russia from my house!” persists, too. Palin never said anything like it, but Dan Quayle was holding the teacher’s cards when he encouraged the kid to add an “e” onto “potato,” and that didn’t matter, either.

The left and left-media attempts to demonize every conservative threat. They failed with Reagan, but succeeded with Goldwater, Quayle, and Palin. Maybe it’s not too much to overcome, but the onus is on Palin to prove that, not upon anyone else to take it on faith.

in the conservative movement.

She is good at needling the President and throwing red meat out to conservatives.

But that does not translate into a winning presidential candidacy.

Palin already had the support of the conservative base. Over the last two years she has not broadened her base, but has simply intensified the support of her most ardent followers.

BTW, Zeigler’s motives are clear- Stop Obama in 2012. Anyone who read the article would have noticed that.

Can have their opinion on Palin and whether or not she is presidential material. All well and good. Mr. Ziegler is perfectly within his right to think and or write about his opinion. Here’s the thing… It is his opinion.. His opinion matters to me personally about as much as a Hollywood actor or actress’s opinion matters to me… nadda… I am quite capable of reading an article, diary, or opinion column written by anybody and taking it for what it is. I can also finish reading that article with no hatred towards the individual that wrote it. You cannot even read the sports page anymore without the author giving his or her ‘opinion’ on why the team lost the game, or who’s fault it was. I have never heard Sarah Palin throw any conservative under the bus, and that is my opinion…. we all have one. She will stand tall whether she runs for the White House or not.

In my humble opinion, as a female 50+ years of age, I am thrilled that Sarah Palin is out there. I have never subscribed to the notion of feminism, and I have never held their position. That group of women do not represent me, never have, never will. I also believe that abortion is America’s version of genocide. I am curious as to why anyone would take the time to defend anyone who writes an article, the readers of this site are smart enough to know opinion vs fact when they see it. Mr. Ziegler has made quite a bit of money off of Sarah Palin though, good for him, the unique capitalist that he is. I know I personally have purchased two of his films, with no regret. What is amazing is the number of conservatives that are unwilling to fight for Palin, but she does not need anyone to fight for her. I hope she does run, win or lose. She will get the message out there, and then 100% back the republican candidate should she lose the primary, which would insure the GOP winner in 2012. The problem is, not too many people would line up to assist her.. All is well and find in the world of opinion.

… It is too reactive to the mainstream media, seeks to impose its vision on the Republican electorate, and when all else fails, resorts to smear and innuendo against someone who has endured more than any other potential candidate under consideration.

I trust the voters. It’s too bad some very vocal Republicans do not.”

http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2011/06/palin-cant-win-palin-shouldnt-run.html

Also…more food for thought today by PollInsider.com:

http://pollinsider.com/2011/06/13/palin-cnn-and-john-ziegler/

http://pollinsider.com/2011/06/13/palin-cnn-and-john-ziegler/

“My loyalty to her was largely instantly regenerated.”

“regenerated loyalty” — that’s like “jumbo shrimp” or “Microsoft Works”. I don’t think Ziegler is using the word “loyalty” in its normally-understood definition.

Bannon’s film “the Undefeated” has gotten deceent reviews.

Jealousy?

that would be one thing.

Say, she had to defend her support of AGW, ethanol subsidies, or state run health care.

But there’s a Marxist in the White House overseeing the explosive unravelling of Americanism, and John Ziegler thinks the biggest threat to conservatism is who Sarah Palin eats pizza with.