Let It Die


euthanasia is fine under some circumstances

The overwhelming odds are that GM is dead.

It suffers from a fatal combination of aging infrastructure, unimaginative management, oppressive union contracts, unsupportable health care costs, and now an emerging recession which has shaken consumer confidence. Any one or two of these could probably be remedied but the entire battery of ills is simply overwhelming.

A doomsday scenario is being painted by those espousing a huge effort to save GM from its own excesses and stupidity. While letting GM fold now will be painful, it will be just as painful and much more expensive to let it fold in the future.

The fact is that GM’s market share will be picked up by the other auto manufacturers strengthening them during these difficult times. Even if the previous level of manufacturer is never achieved again (I think sheer demographics makes that unlikely but it is an argument that some make) dividing the reduced demand among fewer manufacturers makes everyone healthier. In order to meet the demand of that increased market share, the other manufacturers will either have to purchase some of GM’s facilities or hire a lot of current GM workers. Many of GM’s current suppliers will be needed by the remaining manufacturers.

From a political standpoint, I tend to favor an immediate bailout which covers the next three months, dump this in the lap of a President Obama, and demagogue it to no end for the next two years. The best solution for the nation, however, is to swiftly send GM into Chapter 7 and automobile history.


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Creative destruction is called for

1SGinTN (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 11:31AM EST (link)

I’m not a businessman, so perhaps my opinion is not worth much in this matter. Seems to me that a rational business decision is more in order than an emotional one, FWIW.

Again we find ourselves at a decision point where we either act on principles, or act on emotion. I vote for principles almost every time, but then I have often been accused of being a cold-hearted s.o.b.

Tu Ne Cede Malis
-Virgil

 

Amen and amen

E Pluribus Unum (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 11:37AM EST (link)

My preferred 3-month plan is for the Dems to pass a short-term bailout without Repub support, THEN beat the Dems to death with it in the next 2 years.

Kill the Terrorists
Protect the Borders
Punch the Hippies h/t IMAO

 

Seconded

kowalski (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 12:05PM EST (link)

When this debate started a few weeks ago I found myself torn by the question of what I would want for my own company if I was in similar straits. At the beginning that seemed like a reasonable place to begin the argument: a position of empathy.

The more I’ve looked at it, though, the more that comparison doesn’t make sense.

 

Ditto 3 months and let it die n/t

Darin_H (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 12:39PM EST (link)

A visionary coward says that anger can be power, as long as there’s a victim on TV – Flat Top, Goo Goo Dolls

 

The UAW is not our friend

DavidSage (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 1:02PM EST (link)

I know we shouldn’t look at everything through a political lens, but for all intents and purposes, the Big 3 is almost an extension of the Democrat Party.

I’ve heard estimates that the UAW gave tens of millions to Obama and Democrat candidates, in addition to all sorts of “voluntary” organizing and grassroot support.

Michigan is a Democrat cesspool because of the UAW, and other related unions. That state hasn’t voted for a Republican President in over 20 years, and McCain lost the state by double digits. Both Senators are Democrats, in addition to the Governor.

I say let them eat cake. The best thing that could happen to Republicans is if this racket just died off.

BTW, I have a hard time now buying “Big 3″ American cars because I feel like I’m just putting money back into the Democrat Party’s coffers. I used to religiously only buy ‘Merican Cars, and looked down on others who bought “furin” cars, but I got fed up with the poor quality. The fact that I’m also funding political causes and canidates that I oppose just makes it that much easier to buy Toyota’s and Honda’s made by in America by non-union workers in Red States.

 

Use of the word "euthanasia" is a total turn off

JSobieski (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 2:05PM EST (link)

GM is not being denied access to credit market, labor market, capital market, or the automarket.

GM is requesting substantial invasive measures to stay alive in its current form.

Euthanasia cases typically involve pulling out a feeding or breathing tube.

My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.

STOP THE MADNESS!

A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!

 

There is a national security dimension. . .

DFLer Tuesday, November 18th at 4:02PM EST (link)

… to this that matters to the United States, tho few in any part of the political spectrum want to acknowledge it.

As Streiff says, “The fact is that GM’s market share will be picked up by the other auto manufacturers strengthening them during these difficult times.”

But it’s not clear that GM’s market share will be picked up by American firms, even if the replacement manufacturers may have plants in the United States.

We have outsourced more and more of our manufacturing domestically to non-US firms, and internationally to China and other nations that do not share our interests. We have become more dependent on them, and have lost more and more of our independent ability to produce planes, vehicles, and … well, you name it.

I’m as exasperated with GM, Ford and Chrysler as anybody, and part of me would love to watch them sink in their own slop.

But there are some bigger issues here. We should look for ways to bring these firms to heel without letting them go under.

 

Bankruptcy is not euthanasia.

Whitfox (Diary) Tuesday, November 18th at 8:34PM EST (link)

Let’s not make the Democrat’s argument for them by arguing that bankruptcy is the end of GM.

Granted, even if it were, it’d be better than a bailout. Better to directly provide social support to the people affected, than try to do it through a company indirectly. We’ve seen with the Paulson plan that what private companies do with money isn’t what the government intended. (Not that I’m complaining about these companies: about time they showed some sense. It’s just that we should quit banging our heads against the wall labeled perverse incentives.)

But bankruptcy allows businesses to restructure. GM would greatly benefit. No concern that future bankruptcy might make warranties worthless. No legacy contracts based more on wealth redistribution than fair labor. No more money to the same bunch of incompetent executives.

GM was responding well to the challenge of Asian imports, back around 2000. I bought a Chevy Cavalier and was very happy with it. All the more so when the extra safety paid off in a front-to-side collision. (I was on the side that got stove in, without as much as a bruise.) But GM’s cost-cutting without price-cutting made getting a new Cavalier out of the question. Given a chance to get out from under the burden of its failed operations, I think GM can prosper again.

We reap what they sow...

John_Wayne (Diary) Wednesday, November 19th at 10:08AM EST (link)

I think it is obvious to most here on RS that where ever the Democrats have control, economic disaster is the outcome. Whether it be the states of Michigan, California (Arnold is a closet Democrat in my opinion, and the state legislature is fully under the control of the Democrats), New Yory, and the big 3 auto companies thanks to the UAW branch of the Dem party. The states that seem to be doing the best in during this bad economy are those led by Conservative Republican governors and legislatures. Unfortunately, blame for the economic messes caused by the Democrats policies are not spoken of in the media. What angers me is that these failing states and cities are going to Washington with their hands out for a bailout by the federal government. I seem to remember the idiots in California passing a ballot initiative for a $10 billion state investment in stem cell research. Why in blazes should we subsidize idiots like that? I guess I got a little off the subject, but the main point is most of the economic troubles we have today can be traced directly to the Democrat’s tax and regulatory policies, support of unions, and subsidies for their pet social issues.

“Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here! This is the War Room”
President Merkin Muffley

Let those states go bankrupt as well...

izoneguy (Diary) Wednesday, November 19th at 10:13AM EST (link)

…. they are in deep doo-doo and they know it.

What is there answer? Raise taxes of course!!!

It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out
how long it will take before people move to where
the real opportunity is.

And now that the FDIC has announced a program to
help people under water on their mortgages it will only
encourage more to walk away from failing towns & cities.

The point cannot be made often enough: Modern liberalism, as embodied in the Obama presidency, is the defender of the status quo. And the status quo is a road to economic ruin. Political forces cannot redistribute the wealth that the economic system does not produce.

Yep, I agree,

John_Wayne (Diary) Wednesday, November 19th at 10:40AM EST (link)

It is ironic that many liberals who were responsible for wrecking their own states move to states where taxes are lower. They are like a plague or cancer. They move to conservative states and begin the process of tearing down the fiscally responsible governments with their social agenda which demands higher taxes. We have had a huge influx of northeastern liberals here in the south. They will most likely succeed in ruining this part of the country too. If the people in this country don’t wise up soon, we are destined for ruin. We can’t keep going down this road and not expect the same results we have seen in these failed states and industries like the auto manufacturers. Who is John Galt?

“Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here! This is the War Room”
President Merkin Muffley

Is General Dynamics in dire straits, too?

Canthros (Diary) Wednesday, November 19th at 10:47AM EST (link)

Because GD purchased the defense arms of GM and Chrysler years ago.

This too shall pass.

The biggest reason for our decline in

John_Wayne (Diary) Wednesday, November 19th at 10:52AM EST (link)

manufacturing has been government regulation, taxes, and union tyranny. Until the government gets off the backs of business, our system is unsustainable. I don’t see how GM can be saved. They have a terminal cancer brought on by years of first hand exposure to government and union carcinogens. I agree that our manufacturing base has been decimated. I think one of the most blaring examples is that the berets worn by our military are made in China (if I’m not mistaken). There is no ‘government magic’ that will allow our companies to stay in businesses if they can not be competitive and profitable. Given time, the government destroys everything it touches with oppressive taxes and regulation.

“Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here! This is the War Room”
President Merkin Muffley