… I have a feeling that if these kind of techniques are employed, there would be no limit to whom the technique could be applied.

I foresee a gross abuse of these techniques and think that this kind of interrogation should be reserved for non-US citizens.

Although I mildly disagree with you, I will recommend…

I have to really disagree with this entire diary. What you are describing is no different than totalitarian state, only not developed to such as a degree in distopias like those described in Orwellian 1984.

I feel like some of us have become so petrified about terrorism that we are freely giving away our liberties in order to be “safe.”

Recall Benjamin Franklin’s words, “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.”

Rush Limbaugh fans and those in possession of Liberty and Tyrany, tomorrow. It is foolish to think that these techniques wouldnt be used for pretty much anything should they gain acceptance. As long as its not you or someone you know, you wont complain….thats the problem with many in todays system.

Tax smokers, dont tax me….Tax drinkers, dont tax me….Water board child rapists, dont waterboard me,…eventually theyll get to you.

Just like people on this forum learned during tea party season, laws and regulations passed to the praise of people on the right to supress leftists protests in the 60′s were used to break up tea parties.

You assume waterboarding is torture. Secondly you assume same techniques that are applied to terrorists can be applied to US citizens. By implication same rights should be accorded to terrorists as to US citizens or normal criminals.

Jesse is just a loudmouth who asks all questions in rapid succession and has no answers.

I’ve not heard anyone advocating this line of reasoning before so I’ll ask for a clarification. Are you saying the police should be allowed to waterboard after an arrest or only after a conviction? And if waterboarding is OK are stress positions, sleep deprivation, temperature extremes etc OK as well? What crimes are these interrogation methods used for? You specifically mention drug dealing, child abduction and home invasions. Would something like car theft, knocking off a liquor store or identity theft qualify? Each of these are often done in conjunction with a “gang” where knowing the other members would be helpful.

Thanks

American citizens have RIGHTS as citizens and the whole thing clearly is addressed by the whole Liberal (ACLU) argument of WHY WE DON’T BRING WAR-CRIMINALS into the U.S. Courts where morons from the ACLU will try and get U.S. Citizenship RIGHTS extended to War-criminals….. They are Enemies captured on the Battle-field at time of War, they are NOT US citizens…. US citizens cannot be subjected …. really, bothering to go on with this charade would be just silly…… Unless you want to talk about John Walker Lindh “The American Taliban” captured in Afghanistan — I would be more than happy having statutes that would STRIP a citizen of their Rights if they are caught on the Battlefield fighting with/for our Nations enemies – but that is somewhat different and not what Jesse the Mindless Ventura (I say that ‘Mindless’ jokingly, he did some reasonable things as MN Gov, but have to wonder if his brain hadn’t gone completely out to lunch on this one — he’s been around to many Liberals far too long)…..

Ventura is an arrogant liberal. If he holds waterboarding as tortue all of his fellow vets who were actually tortured in pow camps would probably disagree.

Let me say without apology that when our military is fighting to keep us safe under tremendous pressure and people like Ventura, Obama, and like attack them I get very angry. I give this man no moral authority. I do not hold him in the same regard as the american POWS who really were tortured. This controversy needs to die and it can start by Ventura getting off the band wagon.

Terrorists blow up buildings and kill thousands. Street criminals kill on a much lower scale and you don’t fight war on a global scale with street criminals. This is a disrespectful analogy for an educated ex-vet to state. Even Ventura can’t escape the liberal koolaid. He wasn’t a moderate he was a liberal and he still is.

in that alone we should ignore what he say whenever he speaks and that anyone would put them on their show means they didn’t have anyone of WORTH to put on for the day.

We here in these United States of America have due process. The cops cannot just beat you into oblivion and get away with it….I could certainly give you 100′s of links where local and state governments have had to pay out millions upon millions because of militant police officers BTW the communities suffer for their stupidity. I personally don’t have a problem with cops kicking the crap out of scum however my scum may not be your scum etc. The “muslims” that Jesse talked about were TERRORISTS will the express desire to murder as many Americans as possible I personally would have loved if we had BLOWN THEIR HEADS OFF after the waterboarding but WE don’t do that either.

Your coming here to push for assault on the American citizenry and using waterboarding international terrorists as the springboard shows how utterly dense and incoherent your thought pattern is! I would say that the mental gymnastics you and Jesse Ventura use for this argument makes you both leftist’s…there is no doubt in my mind.

I don’t know where you live, but I suggest you move if it is economically feasible. You say our cities are like battlefields, I don’t live where you do so I can just say where I live is not like a battlefield.

I am not going to give more power to government than what is allowed by the Constitution. And don’t try to get me into a back and forth about waterboarding.

Our prisons are full, we have more people per capita in prison than does any other first world nation. We see police brutality and prosecutorial misconduct on a fairly regular basis. No, Ventura did not have a good idea, in fact, the guy is a nut.

Remember the St. Valentines Day massacre – perpetrated by regular crooks in 1929 – it was considered a horrific crime. SEVEN people died – and most of the victims weren’t exactly pillars of morality. Still, that was an extraordinarily violent regular crime.

Remember 9/11 – almost 3,000 people died. That’s what terrorists do. Extraordinary interrogation methods are necessary, proper, and morally right when dealing with terrorists because getting terrorists wet can save THOUSANDS of lives. It is grossly immoral, even evil, not to get terrorists wet, if through inaction or the coddling of terrorists, thousands of people die.

Before Sept 11, the government didn’t waterboard terrorists. After Sept 11 the government did waterboard some of the terrorists – especially the masternminds. Number of big terrorist attacks in America since we started getting a few terrorists wet – ZERO. Case closed.

Jesse Ventura is wrong – we should not waterboard criminals. We should not give our police departments carte blanche to do as they wish. And because waterboarding is decidedly NOT torture, and has proven to be enormously effective in obtaining crucial military intelligence, that is the reason that we should not be using it at home to break the domestic terrorists (ie, criminals) that are systematically dismantling our communities and neighborhoods.

Where I live, honest, hard-working families are not held hostage in their homes. You can walk down the street alone at ANY time of the day, going to the store at 2AM for a pint of milk is not a problem. Walking in my neigborhood in the morning, you can look up and catch someone’s eye and say hello. I go to sleep to a symphony of an air cleaner that my wife like’s to use.

Thank God I have kids.

Since our police address any conditions with the same efficiency and effectiveness that our armed forces address them in Baghdad, I know my neighborhood is peaceful. The lawfulness that we’re seeing take root throughout the Middle East is the sympton of a much larger problem. Instead, Obama wants to support the bad guys and send them back onto the street to cause more havoc.

If we allowed enhanced interrogation techniques in the fight against street crime, that could change. Picture it:

That crack dealer on the corner who won’t give up his supplier? If you started waterboarding them then cops on the street will be even bigger targets.

That sick pedophile who kidnaps kids from the schoolyard to “have his way with them”? Congress just passed a law that protects them against “hate” crimes.

That gang of burglars, rampaging through any apartment with its lights out? If they lived in California then they will probably never see jail time.

Right now, some of our cities resemble battlefields. If we started treating them that way then the good people would leave and all you would have left is insurgents. There are no easy solutions. It all starts at home. If you allow you children to act like hoodlums then they will probably grow up to be hoodlums. Just remember what Jesse Ventura did for a living and will understand what a warped sense of reality this “body builder” has.

I don’t know that I necessarily agree with the diary. It seems like it would be difficult to ensure proper safety and conduct regulations across multiple police departments and communities. Still, I think it’s at least a debatable topic and I don’t see why it’s intrinsically “totalitarian” or “Orwellian.” I think most of us – and most of the American public – agree that waterboarding is not physically uncomfortable or permanent enough to qualify as torture. We use it when we have to, to get results that would otherwise be impossible to get, and we do not do it for the sake of avenging ourselves or making criminals suffer. Moreover, I think most of us believe it’s sometimes necessary if it leads to invaluable information that will save lives.

So why would you say that it’s torture if we do it here to people like Tim McVeigh or domestic mass murderers, but if we do it in Iraq or Cuba, that’s not torture? It just seems inconsistent to me. I don’t think waterboarding is torture in the Middle East OR in the United States. And I think if it’s a reliable and useful tool to save lives, we should use it (like any other legitimate interrogation technique). It seems a bit hypocritical to say it’s only morally permissible in one region.

I mean, to take a really extreme example, if there’s some insane domestic militia group with a bunch of guys born and raised in the US, and 10 bombs are going to go off in 5 hours, and one guy knows all the information, shouldn’t we have regulations and guides to tell us how to get that information in a relatively safe, reliable manner?

Cruel and unusual punishment. It’s in the constitution so you can’t do it to U.S. citizens. The only thing that would allow it is that terrorists are not covered under the constitution or the Geneva convention. Waterboarding was used at direction of only the highest authority and only under the above conditions.

9/11 was unique circumstances. Democrats are using this issue only for political points. You know, the Dems have a three legged stool for their party. Their tactics target the following groups and it works.

1. The ideological pure. They will support the liberals no matter what. The constitution or law does not matter. They will excuse any action, support any political activity to further the cause. The mainstream media is the most important part of this leg as they prostitute themselves to allow their ideological bias to prevail and are the most important factor in influencing the other two legs of the stool.

2. The ignorant. These are the ones who never inform themselves, react strictly on emotion and self interest and have no clue as to the U.S. Constitution or founding principles. They are the product of our education system and are a portion of the “useful idiots”. The media and entertainment greatly influence this leg of the stool.

3. The gullible. These are the remaining portion of the “useful idiots” but can be swayed back and forth with sob stories and the desire to “do good”. They may know basic constitutional principles but their desire for the government to do good on their behalf outweighs any fundamental belief. Many are lifelong Democrats and would not change their alligiance under any circumstance.

But are you seriously saying that if some maniac has bombs all over New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles – and he knows exactly when and where they’re going to go off – you’re not going to allow waterboarding to get that information because of the fifth amendment?