Tonight on his site Flash Report, which is a nice source of California Republican political news, Jon Fleischman announced that he is pulling the proposal to close our state’s Republican primaries.
Right now, anyone who Declines To State a party preference is allowed to vote in our primaries, with the exception of Presidential primaries. But Fleischman had made a proposal, which the party was set to vote on in Indian Wells late this month, that would deny non-Republicans the chance to vote in our primaries. People would have to join our party to have a say in who represents our party.
However two hours ago he wrote this:
After consultation with many fellow supporters of my proposed change in the California Republican Party Bylaws, I made the very difficult decision just a few minutes ago to withdraw the change.
To make a long story short, while I am confident that the votes were there to pass the change at the convention, the matter was becoming extremely divisive due to a lot of misinformation being spread about the proposal, and its effects.
I am disappointed to hear this, and I hope that we don’t pay for it in June.
Moe Lane
Steve Maley
Dan McLaughlin
Neil Stevens
Daniel Horowitz
this being California...
RJD (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 8:51PM EST (link)still, another example of a Republican party scampering back under the rocks.
Republicans setting another bad example
JLenardDetroit (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:23PM EST (link)you are so right…. just when we’re trying to bolster Republicans for FINALLY standing up and doing Right things they prove they are WIMPS and back-down at the first signs of the MSM spreading falsehoods, disparaging comments, etc… PATHETIC!!! Californians should look to replace this wimp next Primary chance!
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Paid off, bought out or threatened
ArchTriumph (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 8:53PM EST (link)Is it just me, or do stories like this make me even more cynical. When someone has the votes on a measure that helps the party become more powerful, more staunch and more relevant and doesn’t take it to conclusion what does that mean? Either this person never really believed in the proposition. Or they were paid off by operatives inside the party who want to destroy the Conservative base within the Republican party that actually votes. Or they were bought out by outside interests who are willing to pay large sums of monopoly money to consolidate power in the hands of their puppets. Or they were threatened by thugs and blackmailers who are willing to take any means necessary to intimidate and kowtow those who would dare to stand for principals.
Then again, maybe I’ve just seen to many sellouts sell out…
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Well, we have one way to push our own agenda
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 8:55PM EST (link)If we don’t like the agenda being pushed by the people currently in power, such as Jon Fleischman, the answer is to get involved with your local party.
Martin Knight’s Committeeman Project is the way to go.
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Calif. Republican Party Has Sold Out!
pippin2000 Monday, September 14th at 1:24PM EST (link)Maldonado, one of the Republicans that voted for the giant tax increase in February, sold his vote to Cogdill, the Republican minority leader. The price for his vote was an agreement to install a “top-two” primary system in California. Maldonado calls it an “open primary.” Maldonado wants to run for State Controller in 2014 and wants the hispanic vote. Hispanic voters are traditionally registered Democrats. It’s sickening what Maldonado and Cogdill have done to the Republican voters. Cogdill is a CASH COW for the Republican Party in California so they will endorse him no matter how he votes. He signed a “no-tax pledge” and ran on no new taxes to get elected; then he was a key architect of the largest state tax increase in U.S. History. The Republican Party has truely been hijacked by these money & power hungry deginerates! Cogdill has been completely bought off and has in turn bought off the Republican Party in California. Since 2001, Cogdill has donated to the Calif. Republican Party $261,000.00 out of his own campaign funds. He has given about $100,000.00 to EACH of many county Republican parties such as Orange County and Stanislaus County. Thankfully, Cogdill IS being challenged in the primary. Check out www.heidi4senate.com if you want to get rid of these guys!
If he had the votes
E Pluribus Unum (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 8:56PM EST (link)he should have persisted. I’m not CA resident and so maybe my opinion is irrelevant, but there is some thing smelly about this.
Kill the Terrorists
Protect the Borders
Punch the Hippies h/t IMAO
Follow the money
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:02PM EST (link)E Pluribus
The CA Republican party is not exactly flush would money, and just guessing here, big name donors put the hard word out that this move would not please them. Money is the mothers milk of all politics, and keeping big donors happy is a reality for any party.
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
Even that doesn't make sense
gahazzah (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:15PM EST (link)Because people aren’t jumping to join the party any longer which means that folks like myself aren’t forced to be party loyal in order to vote in the primaries (and thus influence the party) and thus have no compelling reason to donate to the party.
More money will be lost by this move in the long run than will be gained by big donors in the short term.
/government
Maybe so, but here's a bit more
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:23PM EST (link)A CA lefty Bog, I’ll skip the link, why give them traffic, had a bit about the November convention and the state of finances for the CA Republican party. There are other news sources on this topic, but it’s way inside baseball stuff of CA Republicans, but again money is a pressure point.
“The Republican Party in this state has a $3 million loan from one wealthy individual, Larry Dodge—who extended the term for repayment, wanting a more moderate platform adopted this weekend, and signs that the Republicans would better manage the party and begin to register new voters and things that parties should do.”
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
Interesting
gahazzah (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:27PM EST (link)Though I still think they’re shooting themselves in the foot.
/government
LOL, how could it get more moderate?
Cheryl (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:11PM EST (link)That doesn’t make a damn bit of sense.
“A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America, than the whole force of the common enemy.” –Samuel Adams
“The administrative state has inserted its big paws into our houses, from the toilet bowl to the light socket. Now if it would just stretch those paws from the one to the other at the same time, we might begin to recapture the spirit of ’76.” –Scott Johnson, Powerlineblog.com
Senate race 2006 and others
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:24PM EST (link)Richard L. “Dick” Mountjoy, not exactly a moderate.
Richard Riordan, who lost the Governor’s primary to Bill Simon not exactly a moderate who lost big time to Grey Davis. Riordan was what most would call a RINO, no doubt about it.
Tom McClintock Lt.Governor race, lost to John Garmalidi, with the weak backing of the Girlyman Governator.
At least at the state level, CA R’s have not been moderates running and loosing. At the top of the ticket, we have had the Girlyman Governator and the Republican party and Arnie are sleeping in separate beds, in separate rooms, maybe at times even in separate houses.
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
So he's pulling the proposal which has majority support based on misinformation by his own admission?
AceInTX (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 8:59PM EST (link)Thjs guy’s a Genius…has Cornyn heard about him yet He should be recruited to run for Senate RIGHT NOW!!!
I don't see the logic or understand the reasoning as worded
gahazzah (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:02PM EST (link)As a decline to state voter in CA I’ve never understood why the parties let me vote in their primaries when I shouldn’t have a say in who represents the parties. I’ll choose between the parties in the general but the primaries?
I support the idea of closing the primaries and don’t really understand this move from a tactical point. It reads to me like this;
“There was a lot of misinformation and it was too difficult to make a case for what would have passed anyways so we’re dropping the plan in spite of the status quo hurting our party”.
Weird.
/government
Not sure
proudgop (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:41PM EST (link)I see nothing wrong with allowing Independents to vote in Democrat or Republican party.
A lot times it garners interest for the primary system and thats a positive
Do you have evidence of it helping the party?
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:46PM EST (link)Our fortunes have a party have collapsed in the open primary era.
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Indepen
proudgop (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:50PM EST (link)The primary system in every state should be same for Dems and Republicans
In many states Indep can vote in either primary on election day. I believe it helps garner more voters to vote which is positive and it also helps interest voters you need to win in november
How does CA Dem primary work?
So you think
jackokie Saturday, September 12th at 8:11PM EST (link)you should be able to vote at a company’s stockholder meeting when you don’t own any stock? You should be able to vote at the Rotary Club when you’re not a member? You think Coca-Cola should be able to vote at Pepsi’s marketing strategy meeting?
If political parties are supposed to represent certain approaches to problems (and they do. Why the Republicans came to exist and the Whigs disappeared is a good example). You apparently feel a big government approach is as valid as a small government approach, although they have vastly different consequences.
To follow up,
jackokie Saturday, September 12th at 8:18PM EST (link)the move to primaries confuses the issue. It used to be that party precincts would elect delegates to the county convention, which from that group would elect delegates to the state convention (with perhaps variations on that general theme). So if you were not an active member of the party you had no say whatsoever on who the candidates were. That meant the political pros picked the candidates, which usually but not always gave us better candidates than we’ve been getting lately.
Heh.
mbecker908 (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 8:25PM EST (link)The primary system in every state should be same for Dems and Republicans
Why? They are different parties.
I believe it helps garner more voters to vote which is positive and it also helps interest voters you need to win in november
In the world of “stupid” this statement stands out. Your theory has worked real well so far in CA, huh?
Is it really the open primary or something else
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:53PM EST (link)Neil
I have been pondering this question a bit, is it the open primaries causing the problem of loosing elections or the people who are running as Republicans. Seems like the last time the R mojo was anything good in CA was with Pete Wilson and Prop 187, which I supported.
I’m really not sure what is the root cause, but the fact is R’s have not been winning state wide elections in CA for something like the last 6 to 10 years. Is it the message, the person running, lack of money to run an effective campaign or just the Democrats have gotten so good at pretending to be moderate when they are really crazy San Fran Liberals….don’t know.
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
Demographics
proudgop (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 9:59PM EST (link)Isn’t CA Dem stronghold now cause of demographics?
Aren’t whites the minority in the state now?
That's one theory
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:02PM EST (link)But I don’t buy the racist theory of determinism.
I’d buy that *illegal aliens* voting are swinging elections, but that’s another story.
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I don't think it's a sole cause
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:04PM EST (link)But at the same time the fact is that we have years of results under them. We can look at those results and discard the theory that open primaries increase interest in our party. Registration is declining and our statewide successes are as well.
Open primaries do not acheive their goals. It’s time for a different strategy.
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I disagree
proudgop (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:08PM EST (link)My parents are registered Indep and are solid Republicans but they stay Indep so they can vote in either primary basically because the town they reside in is all Dems ( no republicans run for anything) so they like a say in their local issues. I think a lot people are like that too and I realize people can switch over to become member of party before an election but a lot people find that to be an annoyance
i don’t see how open primaries have hurt the party?
You disagree with what?
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:13PM EST (link)Do you deny that we’ve done poorly in the years of the Open Primary?
What evidence is there to support the claim that they help?
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Not getting
proudgop (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:16PM EST (link)I am not getting how you say we have done poorly with open primary? is is that the winner is not who you like?
the open primary system has been around in a lot states for long time.
confused on what u are saying?
dld1717, is that you? (nt)
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:35PM EST (link)RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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OK, So Has Anyone Checked To See If They're The Same Person?
IJB Friday, September 11th at 10:40PM EST (link)‘Cos I’ve gotten that vibe from Day One…
Well that's twice I've asked him
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 2:53AM EST (link)And twice now he’s completely ignored me.
If he’s a retread and thinks ignoring me will work, he’s wrong.
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Not
proudgop (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 3:01AM EST (link)No Neil
I am woman
Fair enough
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 6:02AM EST (link)But I don’t actually know if dld1717 was a woman.
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In Fact, dld1717 Was a Woman As Well (nt)
IJB Saturday, September 12th at 11:52AM EST (link)Yet you assert something else
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:20PM EST (link)Neil,
Yet you assert that by closing the primary to only registered Republicans they will start winning elections. What if you’re wrong, what if that small minority in the Assembly goes down to defeat in large enough numbers in the Senate to allow Democrats to pass a budget with no restraint by that same R minority?
Is that a bet that should really be made?
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
I didn't assert that we'd magically start winning
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:38PM EST (link)But it’s suicidal to leave the fate of our party in the hands of DTSes who’ve spent the last decade running us into the ground.
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What suicidal is
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:04PM EST (link)Neil
Pretending that CA is part of the deep South with the sort of strong social conservatives that run and win office there can win state wide elections in CA is suicidal.
I’m not suggesting, as you once accused me of, of wanting to send all social conservatives to the salt mines in Utah, but I am stating that a hard core social conservative does not resonate well with the general population of CA.
While I am sure closing the primaries to only Republicans gives back power to the Republican base which is mostly social conservative and would result in a more socially conservative candidate with a R after their name come the general, I don’t think that will increase the number of elected R’s in the Senate, the Assembly or in state wide office. That’s the real politic of electorate and people of CA which is not all that socially conservative and who do vote in the general election.
You want to talk about how closing the primaries will create R’s that grow a pair on fiscal matters, illegal immigration or law and order, I’d be happy to hear how that will work better with a closed primary.
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
Steve, I seem to connect with Neil
Cheryl (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:27PM EST (link)and correct me if I’m wrong, but I suspect you have not lived outside the LA area? I mean, this is a big state and we do have a conservative population, combined with Reagan democrats, it makes a majority. I contend the biggest problem in this state is the Republican brand has successfully been drug through the mud and there’s a heck of a lot of union money pumped into this state.
I don’t see how we can clean up the Republican name by mixing it with mushy moderate thinkers who are only ok using the C word when they’re running in a primary. I quite sick of it. Arnold was our moderate. I suspect right now, people are so pissed by the state of things, they’ll take a right winger if it means things will start to improve.
“A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America, than the whole force of the common enemy.” –Samuel Adams
“The administrative state has inserted its big paws into our houses, from the toilet bowl to the light socket. Now if it would just stretch those paws from the one to the other at the same time, we might begin to recapture the spirit of ’76.” –Scott Johnson, Powerlineblog.com
Lived all over
SteveLA (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:49PM EST (link)Cheryl
I’ve lived all over the country, including growing up in the Deep South of the 60′s so I’ve seen a bit. I’m now living in the Republican part of LA County, which is turning not so Republican it seems. We are getting a lot of LA folks from down below and there is a bit of a shift going on with people who just love a free government handout.
The good thing about this small patch of LA county is that we have some pretty good, and dare I say, moderate elected R’s, who aren’t into making noise just to draw attention to themselves. Even the folk from nearby Kern County, CongressCritters and such are pretty good and not into the Tom Delay smash mouth form of politics and are highly thought of in this area.
I tend to think R’s can start winning again in CA, but they have to focus on pocketbook issues, law and order issues and intelligent ways of dealing with illegal alien problem along with good old fashioned getting out and talking to people about what they want from their government.
People of CA mad, yep that’s true, but they also want someone to tell them what can be done about that anger, and not just play the blame game. Selling solutions to problems confronting this state will win elections, not just blaming the Donks, much as they deserve to be blamed. By the way, if you look at it, the Contract with America was the last big time win at the national level by Republicans, and that was a set of ideas about fixing how government did and did not work, not social issues. Might be a lesson there.
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
I don't think someone would automatically
Cheryl (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 12:05AM EST (link)lose this state because they have social conservative creds. That’s ridiculous. If there’s one thing I learned from living in the bay area, is the only people still in the closet are social conservatives.
“A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America, than the whole force of the common enemy.” –Samuel Adams
“The administrative state has inserted its big paws into our houses, from the toilet bowl to the light socket. Now if it would just stretch those paws from the one to the other at the same time, we might begin to recapture the spirit of ’76.” –Scott Johnson, Powerlineblog.com
Not automatically maybe
SteveLA (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 12:33AM EST (link)Cheryl
Depends on what sort of creds, or how hard core and what the office is. I somehow doubt that the say a Sam Brownback, sort of Pro-Life office seeker would do well, or a Rick Santorum, or just about any high profile supporter of Human life amendment would do well in CA general election in a state wide office, that’s just not where the CA electorate is.
I’m a fan of Pete Wilson and George Dukmajian, so I’m hopeless anyway
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Competency over ideological purity and litmus tests
So do you think that voters in CA
Cheryl (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 3:27AM EST (link)today would vote for a proven liberal spender who’s a serious pro choicer that wouldn’t step foot in a church over a proven fiscal conservative who’s unapologetically pro life and religious?
“A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America, than the whole force of the common enemy.” –Samuel Adams
“The administrative state has inserted its big paws into our houses, from the toilet bowl to the light socket. Now if it would just stretch those paws from the one to the other at the same time, we might begin to recapture the spirit of ’76.” –Scott Johnson, Powerlineblog.com
Because there is no incentive to join/help the parties
gahazzah (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:16PM EST (link)It’s great if you’re in favor of a third (4th, 10th) party system, which I am, but as for as the parties are concerned there is no inherent benefit.
I think in CA the problem isn’t a simple this or that issue. The illegal immigration is a problem, voter fraud is another. The GOP running squishes who cannot run a competent campaign (ala Bill Simon) is another issue. Then there’s the lack of ideas and the tacit support for guys like Arnold and Anthony Adams who do nothing but discourage people from taking the GOP seriously.
/government
Open primaries hurt the party becausePeople are left with a themeless pudding
jackokie Saturday, September 12th at 8:26PM EST (link)instead of a clear choice. If the Republicans had the integrity to call out all the foolishness exhibited in California, they might over time get enough people to give them a shot. Reagan succeeded in part because he could communicate ideas so that some people would think about them and say, “well, I never looked at it that way”. If California doesn’t turn around you’re going to have nothing left but a circular firing squad.
We used to have the same problem in Oklahoma that your parents face: It was a Democratic state. As a result, many conservatives gamed the system by voting in the Democratic primary for those they felt were the weakest candidates. But now Republicans control both houses in the legislature and are pretty sure of getting back the governorship next year. Of course, those Oklahoma Democrats have generally been to the right of our Washington DC RINOs.
The Big Money folk want to shut out the McClintock Crowd
Section9 Friday, September 11th at 9:42PM EST (link)Well, not just Tom, who is a bit of a self-promoter, but the whole Reagan coalition, whom they see as “troublesome”.
Why let Republicans nominate the “Wrong Kind” of Republican? God, such a man (or woman) could become Governor!
“History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it”-Winston Churchill
All Politicians Are Cowards (nt)
IJB Friday, September 11th at 10:21PM EST (link)Jon Fleischman, ball-less wonder
WarEagle01 (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:33PM EST (link)No wonder the Republican party in CA is going down the tubes. Time to ditch Fleischman and get someone who has a pair before it’s too late.
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Can't they do ANYTHING right in California?
scottbomb (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 10:52PM EST (link)www.HowObamaGotElected.com
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Not Why We're Losing California
crosley (Diary) Friday, September 11th at 11:46PM EST (link)I agree that all primaries should be closed to only party members, for a variety of reasons, but that isn’t why Republicans have done so poorly in California. It’s because it’s a state full of liberals. California went from being a very conservative state to a very liberal state.
The independents that vote in these primaries make up a small minority, and I really doubt anyone can conclusively point to an example where a more electable Republican would have been nominated and won if the primary was closed off to independents in California races.
Republicans in California need to choose their battles, and figure out how to play a losing hand. A Santorum type Republican can’t win statewide in California, but a Giuliani type can. Some activists want to go off a cliff waving the flag, but I think we can still achieve important conservative policy goals with Giuliani type Republicans.
Respectfully you don't know the situation here, it seems
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 12:38AM EST (link)Our constitution allows a conservative minority to block tax and spending hikes.
You would have us give that up for a senate seat or two? Not interested.
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Why Not Have Both?
crosley (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 1:11AM EST (link)Run more conservative Republicans in more conservative districts, and statewide, put up Republicans that are a good fit on some hot button social issues. I don’t see how one cancels out the other.
It seems the option some want, make sure only pro-life, social conservatives are nominated, is exactly the strategy Democrats want us to pursue.
In the same way, I would love it if Democrats continued to run anti-gun candidates in the South, but unfortunately they’ve figured out they can give on that issue, and yet still get most of their liberal agenda achieved with these Democrats.
It doesn't work that way
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 1:52AM EST (link)The same people run the CRP, which influence both sets of races.
We can’t have two Republican Parties, one for statewide races and one for ther est.
Not that the base even *wants* pro-aborts, which is why the extreme fringe left of the party is happy that this proposal is going down.
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As a hypothetical
crosley (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 2:52AM EST (link)Let’s say there is a voter that is a hard core conservative. He is closer ideologically to his local Orange County state representative that is more conservative, but feels the Republican running for the US Senate is too liberal on the abortion issue. Does such a voter than not vote for the conservative local state representative out of spite? Does he sit out the general election all together? I can understand if he decides not to vote for that specific moderate Republican Senator in the general election (even though I feel that’s a self-defeating action) but not to other more conservative Republicans on the ballot.
I really don’t see that as a realistic scenario at all, and honestly, if someone who calls themselves a conservative acts that way, I really don’t think we should go out of our way to bend over backwards to placate such a childish voter.
We still have to take it into account
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 6:02AM EST (link)Besides, there’s more than just votes. If I vote for the nominee, but don’t give a dime and don’t lift a finger, then I’m doing my part but I’m not as useful as I could be.
Which is why it’s a feature, not a bug, of closed primaries that they keep the nominees base-friendly.
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where do you get that?
Cheryl (Diary) Saturday, September 12th at 2:03AM EST (link)1) some want only a pro life, social conservative and 2) what do you mean dems want us to pursue this? Do you have an example?
“A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America, than the whole force of the common enemy.” –Samuel Adams
“The administrative state has inserted its big paws into our houses, from the toilet bowl to the light socket. Now if it would just stretch those paws from the one to the other at the same time, we might begin to recapture the spirit of ’76.” –Scott Johnson, Powerlineblog.com
Agree - Stop the two Republican party memes
Fivo Saturday, September 12th at 12:36PM EST (link)I refuse to give anymore money to the California Republican committee until this, at a MINIMUM, is changed. I’ve been telling them this since the 2004 elections whenever they call.
Schwarzenegger has done NOTHING to promote ANY Republican causes because he is a ‘finger in the wind’ politician with absolutely no backbone. The only reason he stood up to the assembly this last budget crisis was that the voters are now bending fiscally conservative no matter what the ILLEGAL union-funded propaganda states ad nauseum over the airwaves.
I’ll save my money for politicians that do ANYTHING to change the government for the better. Joe Wilson did more for Republicans in his one dissent than Schwarzenegger has even projected in two terms. The fact that we still have Barbara Boxer in Congress is so embarrassing I can barely discuss being from California in polite company. Jon Fleischman needs to remember that winning elections is the ONLY thing that matters in politics. Hence, we have a state that is basically rigged to remain a Democratic party bastion.