After a recent posting here at Redstate, I started to notice how anti-Ron Paul people are here for the most part. Granted, the conversation did come up when discussing Palin, so that might have gotten some people hot. Really though, the GOP needs to wake up and grab this before it passes them by for a generation.
What I’ve been trying to scream from the roof-tops to people here and everywhere I go is that in this political climate of out of control spending, Ron Paul’s endorsement matters more than anyone else’s in 2010.
“Truther!” “Paul-Tard!” “Freak!” everyone exclaims with their pitchforks in hand, hoping to put the hunchbacked GOP’er back into the bell tower.
Here’s an article in a recent quasi-paper, but I want everyone to see this part in particular:
A funny thing has started happening to Paul since his long-shot presidential campaign ended quietly in the summer of 2008. More Republicans have started listening to him. There are the media requests from Fox Business Channel and talk radio, where he’s given airtime to inveigh on sound money and macroeconomics. There is HR 1207 , the Federal Reserve Transparency Act of 2009, a bill that would launch an audit of the Federal Reserve System, and which has attracted 112 co-sponsors. When Paul introduced the Federal Reserve Board Abolition Act just two years ago, no other members of Congress signed on.
And then there are the luncheons. The off-the-record talks have brought in speakers such as ex-CIA counterterrorism expert Michael Scheuer, libertarian investigative reporter James Bovard, iconoclastic terrorism scholar Robert Pape, and George Washington University law professor Jonathan Turley. Perhaps the most influential guest has been Thomas Woods, a conservative scholar whose previous books include “The Politically Incorrect Guide to American History” and “Who Killed the Constitution?: The Fate of American Liberty from World War I to George W. Bush,” and whose current book “Meltdown” has inspired Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) to question Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner about economic fundamentals.
You can find the rest of the article here: Ron Paul’s Growing Influence Article
So please, if you feel the rage building in your ulcer, send it to the right people here: HATEMAIL
Also, let me be clear on one critical point. Blowback Theory is not an appropriate foreign policy long term, though a massively reduced footprint in Europe and the Middle East might not be a bad idea.
Palin/Paul? Ha, ha! Now that would start a conversation…
Daniel Horowitz
Neil Stevens
Moe Lane
Steve Maley
Jake Walker
les,
Steph C (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 10:49AM EST (link)It wasn’t Ron Paul on paper that killed his candidacy. It was the debates. It’s hard to get a sense of a man who goes off on tangents instead of sticking to subject at hand. And most of his supporters being obnoxious all the time didn’t help, either.
And that’s just the short version.
“[I]f the public are bound to yield obedience to laws to which they cannot give their approbation, they are slaves to those who make such laws and enforce them.” –Candidus in the Boston Gazette, 1772
Hillbilly Politics
Good shorthand on RP
aesthete (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 1:44AM EST (link)I’d also add that he hasn’t actually gotten any of his initiatives passed in Congress. He’s basically a gadfly, and that’s not a game-killing quality for a congressman, but it is one for a President, where he would have to do more than critique various Federal policies.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
When Ron Paul and his small minded followers...
JadedByPolitics (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 11:29AM EST (link)and I am not saying all of them, start acting LIKE ADULTS then they should be awarded the right to be treated like adults until then they are nothing more than anklebiters!
Unified Patriots – How-To:
Activists Taking Action
Really?!?
Jim Thursday, May 7th at 10:04PM EST (link)Of course I cannot speak for every Ron Paul supporter who has posted on Redstate, but I have seen some well thought out posts in support of Ron Paul and his policies. Typically the response has been irrational, vitriolic reactions to the mere mention of his name.
I seems to me that while other politicians (Romney, Huckabee, Giuliani) get the benefit of the doubt when they stray on one, two, or three issues that are the prevailing policy recommendations on this site, Paul and his supporters gets unmercifully bashed with ad hominem attacks and ridicule.
Again, those who post here and act like fools get what they deserve. But there are positions and policies that Paul supports that are very much in line with the majority on this website. Why not build on common ground and respectfully debate where there are differences?
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
Paul beclowned himself during the campaign
Doc Holliday (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 10:32PM EST (link)he also drew a lot of people who had no clue, just like Obama. The Pauliacs need to forget Paul the man and think about bringing some of his libertarian ideas into the GOP mainstream again. The problem with Paul is the man himself, not many of his beliefs which are good ones. Paul did not come up with these ideas, this country was founded by libertarians. This party was at its best when it followed the simple truths of Goldwater-Reagan.
I think we do need to reach out to libertarians, in fact, we need to get rid of the statists in our midst. But Paul will never be our standard bearer, just like libs like John Edward’s ideas, but he will never play a role in the party again. It is not as bad with Paul, I don’t care if he keeps his seat in Congress and if he wants to start endorsing members of his own party, well, fine. lol
Molon Labe!
Wow, I cannot even take this diary seriously
peg_c (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 12:57PM EST (link)The few Paul supporters I’ve actually met are in my judgment paranoid schizophrenics.
Government cannot be the solution when government is the problem.
I've met plenty of Paul supporters
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:31PM EST (link)who are not. Many of them are well read and quite interesting. Sure, the Truthers and Alex Jones of the world are a little odd to have supporting you, but everyone has different reasons.
The question is whether his policies, which are gaining incredible speed through Congressional caucuses on both side are worth incorporating under the GOP banner.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
Policies = Economic Policies
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:32PM EST (link)Not his foreign policy.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
I'm all for them
Beaglescout (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 2:46AM EST (link)I don’t remember which debate it was. It was one of the early Republican ones. As soon as Ron Paul described how the price of oil had gone up in terms of dollars, but less so in terms of euro, and not at all in terms of gold, I realized he was 100% right. I had been telling my friends for years that I did not understand why Bush was doing everything he could to weaken the dollar. Finally a politician described what was happening with an explanation that fit with my inductions. When he mentioned the Austrian school I looked around and found mises.org. And there, once I discounted the extreme anti-war stance of some, I found the home of sound economics.
Standard economics theory, with a break between macro and micro, is literally broken. Because there is no operative link between micro and macro there is no single economics. Instead you have a patchwork of competing, mutually incompatible theories, chosen by convenience instead of correctness. They are not a system. And they are mostly erroneous.
The neo-Austrian school, founded upon Mises and developed by Hayek and Rothbard, is on the other hand a coherent logical system of economics that spans the gamut from single transactions to huge economies. It explains things that happened and predicts what will happen next.
“A nation which can prefer disgrace to danger is prepared for a master, and deserves one.”
I can understand the concern for the weakening of the dollar that occured under GW,
gekster (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 3:37AM EST (link)but if you think about it, if the dollar gets weaker on the international scale, is it any weaker at home, for Mom and Pop, Sister and Brother, fellow Americans?
The doller is weaker on the global scale, not on the national scale.
It has seemed to be a big difference when the Japanese Yen goes to 100 Yen per Doller as compared to 127 YpD. The less Yen to Doller means that there Country is doing good, not that we are doing bad.
That makes the things made in thier Countriy more equal in cost to things of the same sort made in our Country, not better, just more equal in cost.
That goes throughout the globe, and applies to all countries. Its not that we scale our wealth to our money.
It’s that the world scales it’s wealth to our money.
The weake the Doller per country means that they are getting “more” equal,
not that we are getting less.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
Ron Paul isn't the problem....
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:02PM EST (link)It was all of the leftists who jumped on board his campaign that most of us had a problem with.
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
No, Ron Paul's the problem
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:05PM EST (link)When he made himself an apologize for bin Laden and communist Vietnam, he became the problem.
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Blowback Theory
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:11PM EST (link)is what he follows in his foreign policy, and one of the main areas I disagreed with in the article and agree with you here. Sometimes, foreign adversaries are simply aggressive and to destroy them you have to invade (see Carthage or Tripoli).
This is why Paul will never be a president. However, his monetary policies are what it striking a nerve through the Blue Dogs and Republicans alike and worth expanding the GOP tent over. If we are to expand the GOP tent, it should always be towards those who prefer freedom and liberty, and his monetary policies firmly support that.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
His monetary policies are dangerously deflationary
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:14PM EST (link)Freedom has nothing to do with it. It’s just classic kookery.
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Uh, I'm not an economic historian
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:21PM EST (link)but I think inflation is the problem. Contrary to what Gibbons may have said about moral decay, it is more likely that a continual debasement of the Roman reserve currency is what caused their decline. There’s plenty of research you can look into to verify that fact.
Also, freedom has everything to do with it. The revolution was an economic one in part, “No taxation without representation.” Economic freedom is tied quite tightly with political and spiritual freedoms.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
What inflation? (nt)
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:26PM EST (link)RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Inflation is why your 2009 dollar is worth
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:29PM EST (link)the same as 5 cents in 1914. Better yet, $1 in 1914 is now worth $21+. That’s debasing a currency. We do it through fiat paper, which the Founding Fathers were VERY set against based on their experiences with paper money (the Continental) during the Revolution. The Romans and many other nations would do it by shaving the actual metal content of the money down so it was physically worth less.
You can find rates here; http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/inflation/consumer-price-index-and-annual-percent-changes-from-1913-to-2008/
You can do conversions here: http://www.dollartimes.com/calculators/inflation.htm
Inflation is a long term problem and a moral issue of devaluing human productivity in a fiat system. Deflation is the correction of this system, and what Harding did in 1920-21 to rejuvenate the economy in 1920 and pay off 1/3 of US debt until Hoover turned progressive and created more government interference leading to the crash of 1929.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
There's no denying inflation but you really can't
Achance (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:50PM EST (link)make comparisons over very long periods of time about what a “dollar” will buy. Both technology and markets change too much for comparing “purchasing power” in 1921 dollars to 2009 dollars. What would a laptop computer have been worth in 1921? You’d probably have been able to rule the World with one!
We do have the worst of all possible circumstances confronting us now, though. The most common consumer measure of inflation, the BLS’ Consumer Price Index – Urban Wage Earners is heavily weighted to shelter which is deflating sharply. This will show that there is zero inflation on the CPI-U while all sorts of things real people buy every day are going up in price. Consequently, things like wages and pensions that follow CPI – U will be stagnant while prices of food, fuel, etc. inflate.
In Vino Veritas
I agree
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:59PM EST (link)that the problem is huge with inflation and the Mises Institute would also agree.
The laptop comparison would fail because you’re comparing standard of living, as a laptop is a tool for productivity. Would you compare it to say, a mechanical sewing machine of the time, or something like that? They would be comparable items possibly for their time.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
And
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 5:00PM EST (link)I think that a laptop in 1914 would make for a great sci-fi flick. The Nerd World Order…
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
Tell you what
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 3:19PM EST (link)You tell me how to create a *stable* currency, and I’m listening.
But gold isn’t it. Gold gives you deflation. Gold gives you regular panics like we used to have.
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I thnk the burden of proof
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:56PM EST (link)would fall on those saying the Gold causes regular panics. I’m not sure when that time would be, and if there ever was, I think it would involve debasing using lead.
I don’t think Paul or the Mises Institute recommend going fully back to a gold standard, but of a mixed standard which would at least bring some backing to the currency.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
Wrong
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 5:30PM EST (link)The burden of proof is 100% on the people calling for change.
So let me know.
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Totally agree Neil - the problem today is only partially attributable to a loose monetary policy, and
Mike gamecock DeVine (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 5:36PM EST (link)no one can look at monetary policy beginning in1981 and even earlier when we had learned the lessons of the great depression and the FED mistakes then, and argue for a return to a standard that hurt the US, and given our benevolent and paramount position in the world, and the world.
The main false assumption here is that there is some currency standard that can eliminate recessions.
There is not.
Did Greenspan keep int rates too low for too long after the tech bubble and 911? yes
But only other coincident factors caused the crisis.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” – Andrew Jackson
Neil....allow me to modify my comment...
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:13PM EST (link)Ron Paul was not a big problem to me…his followers were. I can understand the non-interventionist tendencies of Libertarians…I don’t really agree because I believe we have a moral responsibility to do what we can, but I can understand the tendency.
As far as his blowback philosophy….well there is truth to it, in that for every action there is a reaction…I just don’t agree with him as to who created that first action.
Many of Ron Paul’s principles are in line with the Republicans way more than Specter…so in that sense I guess Ron Paul being the problem is relative.
Like i said…for me it was his followers that were the big problem…not Paul himself.
YMMV
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
HIs followers were my biggest problem, too.
Steph C (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:21PM EST (link)That and the fact that he couldn’t stay on topic when speaking but tried to spit out everything at once. When there are so many tangents in what he says, how can you trust him to govern with any kind of focus?
“[I]f the public are bound to yield obedience to laws to which they cannot give their approbation, they are slaves to those who make such laws and enforce them.” –Candidus in the Boston Gazette, 1772
Hillbilly Politics
I agree with that Steph...
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:31PM EST (link)He was spontaneous to say the least…I never considered him as an actual viable candidate for the Presidency…rather in the context of the Diary, I was saying that Ron Paul isn’t all bad outside of his recent run for POTUS.
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
If not speaking eloquently...
Jim Thursday, May 7th at 10:46PM EST (link)…is the major criticism, then I can think of a lot of other Republicans who fall into that category. Clearly he is no Reagan in his speech, but he does have some interesting and positions that could expand the GOP base for the better.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
Aaron, I had issue with his supporters and him
peg_c (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:14PM EST (link)The Ron Paul I saw during the campaign was not a rational person. He seemed OK at times and then in slipped pure insanity that spun your head around. His followers are folks who can’t tell the difference or who live in that same alternative dimension with him. I’m not following any politician into a worm hole.
Government cannot be the solution when government is the problem.
Peg....Glimpses of crazy were definitely present...
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:18PM EST (link)Although I really wasn’t limiting my comment to his campaign. Paul’s followers were much worse than Paul himself….at least to me, now this shouldn’t be read as an endorsement of Paul for President either.
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
he doesn't seem too realistic
mom2oneson (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:35PM EST (link)I try not to be a negative nellie but I think some of his ideas weren’t down to earth enough. I didn’t hear much from him but what I did didn’t seem realistic enough to get things accomplished. He was talking about healthcare and privitazing healthcare charity (which I’m all for) but then he made the comparsion of how he worked for $3 an hour or something back in 19___(long time ago) when he was a gynecology resident.
OMG I forgot about that
peg_c (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:58PM EST (link)Can you imagine being in an examining room with him…?! I’d run screaming into the woods.
He could have gotten a role in the new Star Trek though. Fit right in.
Government cannot be the solution when government is the problem.
ROTFL!!! nt
mom2oneson (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:10PM EST (link)Ok, that was funny...
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:18PM EST (link)but I still think his point is that he could deliver babies that cheap and now healthcare is simply outrageous with all the regulation…
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
but that wasn't even a relveant example
mom2oneson (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:26PM EST (link)I mean of what a resident made in 19__(long time ago)? Why not give some relevant examples of loser cost primary care clinics that are sort of private vs medicaid if that is what his point or some volunteer clinics that have specialist volunteering or the non profit policies that makes hosptial write off a portion of their bills to charity. Or the low cost of home births with midwives. I don’t know a thing about healthcare administration and I can give better examples. That was totally disappointing because I’m all for small government and no healthcare type of welfare.
Yeh, you're right.
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 2:31PM EST (link)He could have used a better example.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
I Can't forgive him for Montana
cooganug Thursday, May 7th at 1:14PM EST (link)By allowing his name to be on the ballot in Montana, Ron Paul was actively working to elect Obama. I have no love for McCain, but any supporter of a man who essetially worked to elect a man who wants to trample over every freedom that we have should not be welcomed back.
5 (nt)
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:26PM EST (link)RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
McCain won Montana, didn't he?
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 1:26PM EST (link)It’s different when you’re running against someone than for someone else. I’m usually supportive of 3rd party candidates rights to run, though I do see the problems it can cause in presenting a unifying front. You can’t blame a man for playing to win, can you?
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
Actually yes we can blame him
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 3:21PM EST (link)He’s a dishonest man. It’s dishonest to run as a Republican for the nomination, and then to refuse, much like a petulant child, to endorse the man who beat you.
It’s dishonest to be ready to accept the endorsements of others when you have no intent to give the same in return.
Ron Paul is a fraud.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
I agree
gonzo55 (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 3:31PM EST (link)and his opposition to the gold standard and the Iraq war is tinfoil hat stuff. Not too surprising he appealed to so many young libs.
“Facts are stubborn things” — Ronald Wilson Reagan
Whoa people
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:15PM EST (link)It’s not dishonest to not support a man who defeated you. What is this? Some kind of masochistic submission team? He wanted to be head of the party based on his beliefs and when that didn’t happen, he didn’t want to compromise those beliefs. Everyone here who now bashes McCain should honestly ask themselves why they supported the ticket in 2008, and don’t use the Palin excuse. Because Paul at least had the courage to say it was wrong from the beginning to put McCain up there. It’s because we wanted to have an (R) by the presidents name even if he was a friggin Dem. To say we won.
He (Paul) in fact told his supporters on a number of occassions to not waste their votes on him if he’s not on the ballot, which was the case in Pennsylvania and to support the Republican ticket.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
It's not masochistic, but it's a team
Neil Stevens (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:25PM EST (link)Ron Paul pretended to join the team only as long as it suited him, and after he didn’t get his way, he betrayed us.
Ron Paul is a dishonest man. He should be ashamed of himself, and I don’t understand the workings of a mind that supports him in any way.
Ron Paul is the greatest embarrassment that ever fell upon right-wing thought in my lifetime.
Ron Paul has no courage, no convictions, no principle, no loyalty. It’s all about him getting more gold from the willing hands of deluded people.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
What is Right-Wing Thought?
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:46PM EST (link)I don’t agree at all obviously with your assessment, but you raised an interesting comment for sure with this one.
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
You're right, conviction is a bad thing.
Jim Thursday, May 7th at 10:55PM EST (link)“Ron Paul pretended to join the team only as long as it suited him, and after he didn’t get his way, he betrayed us.”
So if the GOP nominates someone (McCain) who opposes just about every position you hold dear, you should support him anyway? Come on! There are certainly more substantive things to criticize Ron Paul on. His not supporting a terrible RINO presidential candidate is not one of them.
I would challenge you to read his book (The Revolution) and then repeat the statement you just made. If we can look past Giuliani’s pro-abortion stance, or Romney’s socialized medicine stance, or Huckabee’s populist/anti-free-market stances, then why is Ron Paul’s foreign policy a complete and total showstopper?
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
Who's this "we" you refer to?
aesthete (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 2:01AM EST (link)For most, those very issues *were* the show-stopper. There were several on this blog who were opposed to these candidates for that very reason, and Huckabee in particular was very much opposed around these parts. Guiliani was pretty “meh” for most of us (not me, but I’m odd
), and when Fred came along, most preferred him.
You and lesreaper are (apparently) presenting a good-faith argument, and I don’t begrudge you that, but I don’t blame the RedState community for rejecting Paul, either. Paul supporters on the site were notoriously spammy argumentative, and rude, and wouldn’t let up no matter what. One comment post that was all-to-representative was, “I smell Hebrews”.
Honestly, I don’t hate the man, and think that he has a role to play in the Republican party. Heck, if it’d been in between him and McCain, I probably would have voted for him. However, I think that his lack of leadership or administrative credentials really rules him out for consideration as President, and think that his time would be better served getting Republicans who share his views elected, and not just complaining about the Repubs currently in office.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
It's not the conviction. It's the kookery.
Neil Stevens (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 9:41AM EST (link)It’s not conviction. It’s kookery.
And dishonesty.
And miserable failure as a member of Congress.
And hypocrisy.
And shilling for Al Qaeda.
And shilling for Communists.
And tacit support for Naziism.
And gold buggery.
If he doesn’t want to support our nominee, he need to get out of our party like a true honest, principled man would do in his position.
But no. He just wants to keep taking his Congressional paychecks without actually acting on his supposed principles.
Ron Paul is slime.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Whatever...
Jim Friday, May 8th at 9:47PM EST (link)I think the vapidness of your comments speak for themselves.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
I'll take that from you, considering the source
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, May 9th at 7:52AM EST (link)Considering you’re linking to Lew Rockwell in your sig? And quoting some kooky “economist” who pushed some radical pacifist ideology? Yeah, consider the source, consider the source.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
You know what, you're right!
Jim Saturday, May 9th at 8:44AM EST (link)The fact that I read some books about Austrian economics and probably have a more libertarian vein than some on this site discredits everything I am saying.
Perhaps we should have everyone include their resume in their sig to evaluate whether they are the “right kind of people” to openly debate and rationally discuss ideas.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
Oh you almost make it too easy
Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, May 9th at 8:56AM EST (link)You are the stereotypical arrogant Austrotard with a chip on his shoulder.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
No, I am (was) trying to rationially discuss...
Jim Saturday, May 9th at 9:45AM EST (link)…the content of lesreaper’s post in a respectful and non-inflammatory manner, and all I see in reply is insults and ad hominem attacks.
Looking back, it was not I who violated Goodwin’s Law.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
But it could have mattered
cooganug Thursday, May 7th at 1:32PM EST (link)We have to consider what information was available at the time:
Ron Paul knew he could not win.
Although unlikely, everyone know that there was a small chance that Montana’s votes could matter.
Everyone knew that Paul was taking votes away from McCain, not Obama.
The fact that Obama won easily doesn’t change the fact that Ron Paul chose to hurt the party.
I think of Gladiator
lesreaper (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 4:18PM EST (link)when Maximus asks the chief of his guards Quintus in reference to the barbarians they were about to crush, “Would you know when you were defated? Would I?”
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will preserve for our children this, the last best hope of man on earth, or we will sentence them to take the first step into a thousand years of darkness.
-Ronald Reagan
GC recos for the discussion and I have no rage for THE ONE WHOS NAME COULD NOT PREVIOUSLY BE UTTERED
Mike gamecock DeVine (Diary) Thursday, May 7th at 5:39PM EST (link)RP is so right on so much: big guv, federalism
But is so wrong on national security and the fed
more later
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” – Andrew Jackson
Look...
Jim Thursday, May 7th at 11:10PM EST (link)…I thought the guy was a complete nut when I first started hearing about him last year. Then someone I know (who is not a kook) who was a hardcore Ron Paul supporter explained some of his positions to me. I ended up reading The Revolution and I have to say, he does fall in line with a majority of the positions held by people on this website. Yes, he does not buy into the Bush foreign policy. Besides that, he is hardcore small-government, pro-life, and fiscally responsible. He’s well read, knows his stuff and, like lesreaper points out, is attracting more and more positive attention by members of Congress and the press.
I really am just baffled by the knee-jerk hate I see on this website for the guy.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
I don't think it goes as high up as the knee :)
aesthete (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 2:06AM EST (link)We’ve pretty much associated RP followers with spam: the election season was ridiculously rife with RP supporters inundating the forums with mindless babble about the gold standard and Zionism. I don’t have the visceral hatred for RP that others do, but I don’t blame those who do.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
You would not be baffled by what you call...
JadedByPolitics (Diary) Friday, May 8th at 7:01AM EST (link)the knee jerk reaction to Ron Paul and his merry band of idiots had you been around to see how those tools and yes they are no better than the leftards so TOOL will be used to describe them acted during the primary for their Dear Leader and if you think for one moment that RP was not lauded as Obama is to his left then you have not done your research on recent history and the RP show!
I think that paragraph pretty much describes it but I will end by saying that it is apparent from reading through the thread that you and les are kidding yourselves if you think you are going to be pulling people over to the RP movement it should be more YOU ALL JOINING the Conservative movement that seeks to get the issue’s back to the states! There is no leader to coalesce behind at this time but as the movement slowly SMACKS around those in the Republican Party someone will shake out! I GUARANTEE YOU RP is not the answer he is an old tired fool with isolationist ideas and racist, hateful followers…it appears you are new to the RP movement please read up on how they acted and why they are despised!
Unified Patriots – How-To:
Activists Taking Action
I speak for myself, don't lump me in...
Jim Friday, May 8th at 10:12PM EST (link)…with people I don’t know or associate with, and insinuate I am a racist hate-monger. I am sure it galls you when people on them left paint YOU with that brush simply because you’re right-of-center.
I am not saying he should be president.
I am not saying he would be an effective leader of the Republican party.
I am not saying he is charismatic.
I am not saying that everyone on RedState needs to become shills for Ron Paul.
I am simply saying that it would be wise to find common ground on areas where there is agreement, especially when his ideas appear to be bringing new people into the movement. Period.
But even that seems to be too much to ask of some people around here. At least you are living up to the goal in your signature pic of “Disproportionate Response.”
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken
Don't take it personal
Vegas_Rick (Diary) Saturday, May 9th at 12:24AM EST (link)Like Jaded said, most of the Ron Paul supporters who came around here were very messy house guests. Crapping all over the place.
You seem like a resonable fellow. I share many policy positions with Mr. Paul. However, his head-in-the-sand foriegn policy is a non-starter with me.
I am not a single issue voter, but without a strong, effective foreign policy, nothing else matters. IMHO.
“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington
“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.
Thank you...
Jim Saturday, May 9th at 8:32AM EST (link)That is a reasonable and understandable statement, and I appreciate the substance of your comment.
“If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion.”
F.A. Hayek
“Laws are no longer made by a rational process of public discussion; they are made by a process of blackmail and intimidation, and they are executed in the same manner. The typical lawmaker of today is a man wholly devoid of principle — a mere counter in a grotesque and knavish game. If the right pressure could be applied to him, he would be cheerfully in favor of polygamy, astrology or cannibalism.”
H.L. Mencken