Yesterday, I filled in for Neal Boortz on his syndicated show and was live on air as the news was breaking from the horror in Oslo, Norway.
With Al Jazeera, international news networks, and domestic networks all raising the link to an Islamic radical Norway was deporting, I put on twitter that the odds were it wasn’t an angry Lutheran doing the bombing and shooting and noted on the radio the possible links to Islamic radicals.
Turns out, the now captured shooter, who I think we can probably say is connected to the bombing, lists himself as a conservative Christian on a Facebook page.
I was wrong. But the reaction to me and others being wrong and to how the news is handling this event is quite instructive.
In the Arkansas army shootings and the Ft. Hood shooting and a host of others, the media and the left have sought to downplay any possible connection to Islam the attackers or would be attackers have had. And when those of us on the right have pointed it out, we’ve been accused of racism and those on the left have demanded to know why it even mattered.
Contrast that with the coverage of the Oslo shooter and already the New York Times is making sure in its first few paragraphs everyone knows the guy described himself on Facebook as a “conservative Christian.”
It reminds me of the left-wingers who always point out that Eric Rudolph and Timothy McVeigh were Christians. They ignore the fact that McVeigh himself described himself as at best an agnostic, though more clearly an atheist, and Rudolph’s FBI file showed he belonged to an extremist cult more Aryan than Christian.
But why all the angst from the left on this.
There are a few instructive points.
First, those of us on the right who point out the now fairly common ties between terrorists and Islam do so largely because the secular left has become willfully naive. The fact of the matter is violence and Islam may not be very common among American muslims, but internationally it is extremely common and can fairly well be considered mainstream within much of Islam. Read Andy McCarthy if you suffer on the delusion that it is not mainstream.
With Christians, it is rather rare to see a self-described Christian engage in heinous terrorist acts. In fact, in as much as there is an Arab Street filled with muslims more often than not cheering on the latest terrorist act of radical Islamists, you will be very hard pressed to find a Christian who does not condemn the act regardless of the faith of the person doing the killing.
But then why is the left so gleeful that the Norwegian is a “conservative Christian” and why do they feel it so necessary to rub it in when they’re downright apathetic and hostile to the notion of radical Islam being rather mainstream within Islam when terrorist Christianity is largely nonexistent except among a few crazies?
Not to put too fine a point on it, but the Bible is quite on point about this.
Secular leftists and Islamists are both of this world. Christians may be traveling through, but we are most definitely not of the world. In fact, Christ commands us to throw off our ties to this world. But the things of this world love this world and hate the things of God. That’s why secular leftism can embrace both activist homosexuals and activist muslims when the latter would, when true to their faith, be happy to kill the former.
All of them can pile on and condemn the Christian because the Christian is just passing through, a stranger in a strange land.
Over the next week, assuming the budget fight in Washington doesn’t over shadow it, you can expect lots more gloating that the guy in Norway described himself as a conservative Christian. Never mind that a conservative Christian would not do what the guy did. The left, however, will not be persuaded otherwise. They are of this world and this world is all that matters until the last day.
Victoria Coates
Daniel Horowitz
I don't care that guy called himself on Facebook,
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 11:49AM EST (link)he is most definitely NOT a Christian. A Christian does not open fire on innocent children, murdering people. I will be interested to see what his true connections are.
I keep remembering how the Left initially tried to portray that crazy who murdered people in AZ.
Kowalski
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:04PM EST (link)I might also add that those who claim McVeigh was a Christian are ignorant. I live in Oklahoma and it was widely reported here that he was an avowed atheist who actually despised Christians. The man was a monster.
What about the Abortion Clinic murderers?
etchasketchist Saturday, July 23rd at 7:26PM EST (link)C’mon people. They’re Christian as Christian gets. They are obsessed with abortion and Jesus and they murder and fire bomb clinics. I’m sorry if you think they’re not Christian, but that’s your personal opinion and labelling. Go visit them in prison and they will quote you chapter and verse where exactly they got the idea that murdering nurses and doctors is God’s will. I’m sick of the right not owning up to the violent element within it. I’m sorry if you can’t imagine a world where only Liberal Muslims Gays are bad White Christians Who Like Tax Cuts are all good. But good lord. You love guns. You love war. You hate people who are different than you. You want to rid the world of liberal scum. I listen to your radio shows. Listen to yourselves for a second. Use this time for some self reflection. I can’t believe people who tried to make Obama out to be a member of the Weather Underground are all of a sudden shocked and appalled when people point out that there are violent extremists active in their movement. KKK members don’t vote for Democrats. The Aryan Nation do not support higher taxes and free health care and gay marriage. Your nice, respectable, Tea Party/GOP political movement has some fellow travelers that are crazy and armed and organized.
Perhaps you would like to quote chapter and verse.
kipling (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:52PM EST (link)Please, by all means, point to the words of Jesus where he urged His followers to take up arms against those of other beliefs.
Your KKK comments demonstrates your ignorance of history. It was the Democrats who supported the KKK, elected them to the Senate, and tried to filibuster Civil Rights legislation.
Every abortion clinic has a number of murderers in it. They are the doctors and nurses who make a living by killing unborn children.
I think it's in Levitcus
etchasketchist Saturday, July 23rd at 8:25PM EST (link)Somewhere near the anti-gay stuff and shell fish. I’m not a christian or doctor murderer so I can’t help you out. I suggest you watch Lake of Fire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_of_Fire_%28film%29) and you’ll see doctor killers calmly explaining to the police their biblical rationale for violence.
And I’m not talking about the Dixicrats who all became Republicans like Strom Thurmond. I’m talking about current members of the Ku Klux Klan who do things like run in Republican primaries for governor of Louisiana. Klansman in the south in the 20′s vote for Democrats. But they don’t any more. They vote for the most conservative, right wing Republican they can find.
And I’m going to ignore that insane final statement about doctors and nurses because I think you know how ugly and disturbing it is.
Notice this common trend in liberal objections to Christians.
jeffreywturner (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 2:21PM EST (link)“anti-gay stuff”
Whether its abortion or gay rights or whatever, almost every liberal Christian-basher’s real underlying problem with Christianity is related to something about sex.
“Life is too short, can’t we all just eat pork and kill some terrorists?”
Leviticus is "Old Testament" and Talmic and altho'
renny (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:27PM EST (link)not divorced from Christianity, if you want to argue a Biblical point on Christianity and what Christ said, you must cite the New Testament.
Not all Christians are dispensationalists.
NightTwister (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:37PM EST (link)For some, like me, all scripture is beneficial…
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter. – Winston Churchill
Interesting how...
rangerwife Monday, July 25th at 10:04AM EST (link)you feel it is “ugly and disturbing” that doctors and nurses are murdered, but do not have the same feeling about the babies they were just ripping apart in their mothers wombs.
As a Christian, the lives of all are important and it is tragic when either doctor or baby is murdered. If you would like Christians to look at their bias, you really should take a look at your own and do some “reflecting” of your own. Why do you only want to protect and defend the murderers, homosexuals, Islam and everything the Bible is against? Rebel against God much?
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” — George Orwell
Ugly and Disturbing?
sylviacroft Monday, July 25th at 6:24PM EST (link)I’ll tell you what’s ugly and disturbing: that anyone who regards themselves as a normal human being can day after day cut fully formed human babies into lots of pieces and then pull little arms and hands and feet and faces out of a woman’s body and haul all those little pieces out in bed pans to throw them in the trash.
It is completely incomprehensible to me. It’s not even rational. There is something really twisted in that person’s mind that they could go to sleep at night after what they’ve been doing all day.
sylviacroft
Moe Check out etchasketchist
kipling (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:07PM EST (link)I don’t know what qualifies to have someone booted by this guy seems to only be hear for one reason.
Ban me. Sure
etchasketchist Saturday, July 23rd at 8:27PM EST (link)Awesome way to encourage dialogue at this time. But don’t check me out too much. I don’t want you IP sniffers figuring out where I live. My mom lives here too. And she used to volunteer at a Planned Parenthood clinic that got firebombed by a Conservative Christian.
They should
powertothepeople (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:44PM EST (link)because from the list of leftist idiots who come here and spew nonsense, you take the cake for biggest dumb ass. And no one cares that your mom is fine with a low life job that promotes the murder of our children. If you are fine with her being a scumbag, all good for you.
And by the way, we have no interest in dialogue with leftist. Your side has little to say that you did not say 30 years ago. Not too mention we do not want to waste out time and idiots, moronic “ideals,” failed “ideals,” and the scum suckers who pander the BS. Clear enough for you?
correction
powertothepeople (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:45PM EST (link)Not too mention we do not want to waste out time and idiots, moronic “ideals,” failed “ideals,” and the scum suckers who pander the BS.
Should be
Not too mention we do not want to waste our time on moronic “ideals,” failed “ideals,” and the scum suckers who pander the BS.
don't scare him away,
gekster (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:47PM EST (link)i want to play with him.
slow day and all.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
aww, too late. nt
gekster (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:48PM EST (link)…
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
OK
Erick Erickson (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:45PM EST (link)I did.
Who will stand on either hand and keep this bridge with me?Follow @EWErickson
My mom lives here too
gunslingr45 Monday, July 25th at 9:34AM EST (link)another trait of the left.
Socialism billions dead, but they keep trying it…..
etchasketchist, not sure what "dialogue" you provide...
vandalii Monday, July 25th at 1:36PM EST (link)(love the username though
.
Straw men are much easier to put up and knock down, as you’ve demonstrated. That, however, doesn’t constitute “dialogue”. On the other hand, dumping you out-of-hand because you disagree with most of those in this blogspace is a bit much. There have been some that have nothing to offer but profanity and the usual racist-hillbilly-teabagger-uneducated-racist-racist-did-I-rmemeber-to-say-racist? tripe that just waste everyone’s bandwidth. Thus far you don’t appear to be such as they, just someone that disagrees with most of us on this thread.
If your point is to show that there are mis-guided people calling themselves Christians (and I couldn’t tell you for sure what their “Book of Life” status is, myself) that do heinous crimes, you are correct. If you want to be serious about a whole sub-segment of a culture, we should really point out the Crusades or the Inquisition when Christ’s message was hijacked by crazy political crazies justifying their actions as the “will of God” without accurate Scriptural backing. Yep, God’s worst representatives here on earth are His own children
.
What we’re dealing with today has to do a sub-culture within Islam that has actaully institutionalized terrorism as part of their theology on the one hand, and isolated whackos on the other, claiming to be Christians while missing Christ’s message to love your enemies.
Hope that helps with a little perspective…
“Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time he will pick himself up and continue.” – Winston Churchill
I also meant to extend an apology to your mother...
vandalii Monday, July 25th at 1:42PM EST (link)…for being injured by someone twisting the BIble or Jesus’ words to justify unjustifiable violence to your family and your mother in particular.
I pray the individual that did this was captured, tried and sentenced and that one day you and your mother can discern the difference between what this person did and what Christ calls His people to do.
“Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time he will pick himself up and continue.” – Winston Churchill
Can I ask you something, etchasketchist.
gekster (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 8:36PM EST (link)The whole point of the article is that even when someone calls themselves Christian, when they do these things, it just proves that thier not Christian.
But you missed that didn’t you, because all you really wanted was to go on a Christian, conservative hate rant.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
The difference
Christine (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 2:41PM EST (link)is that good Christians denounce the murder of others regardless of the banners they claim to carry…and we further denounce them as Christians. The fact that they quote our Holy Book does not make them one of us.
It would be a wonderful thing if other groups would do the same on a larger scale.
The primary process is FLAWED. Two states should not decide our candidate.
“I would be a poor Commander in Chief”
– Barack Obama, July 3 2008
Well, Sir....
rowdydfw Sunday, July 24th at 4:05PM EST (link)The abortion clinic assasign didn’t kill a gazillion children…they were after the murderers of about 5,000,000,000 children. And you call them extremists?
What’s exteme is the murder of human babies EVERY DAY by the thousands by whacko liberal assassigns promoting the MYTH that women have some how found themselves the mystical right to murder their babies just so they can get in their freaking prom dresses and clear their social calendars!
While I agree with your anger...
vandalii Monday, July 25th at 1:49PM EST (link)…I disagree that two wrongs make a right (takes three lefts to do that — jes’ kiddin’).
Some of us seem to forget “…’Vengence is Mine, says the Lord.’ No, ‘if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals upon his head’. Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.” Rom 12:19b-21.
We’re to love them to death, not firebomb them to death
“Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time he will pick himself up and continue.” – Winston Churchill
Anyone who does not live the Gospel of Christ
losmacs Monday, July 25th at 8:49AM EST (link)is no Christian, regardless of the tag they place upon themselves. We are called to love our enemies, to remember that all men are our brothers and that if one hates his brother, he is a murderer, to repay evil with good. It ain’t easy; we all struggle with sin every day. Only the love of Christ Jesus can bring us through the difficult times when we want to revenge ourselves against those who wrong us. My first cousin was a victim of murder; only by giving my baser instincts to Christ for cleansing was I finally able to forgive his killer and feel peace within myself.
So it isn’t the label that one uses to describe oneself, its what happens in the soul of a Christian that determines if one is a true believer. That fella from Norway is no Christian.
Wow. Just, wow.
Plumb_Bob (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 10:53AM EST (link)The level of ignorance in this paragraph is unimaginable.
There are roughly 2.1 billion Christians in the world today. Do you know how many abortion clinic murders there have been in the last ten years?
One.
And did you notice all the Christian groups falling over themselves to denounce the murder as unacceptable?
Do a little comparison, now. Visit thereligionofpeace.com and scroll down to where they list the Islamic terror attacks that have taken place within the last 2 months. They’ve been maintaining that list for several years now. It’s always as long as it is today. This is a worldwide, consistent pattern. Now, compare that with the Christians who “murder and fire bomb clinics,” all ONE of them. Go ahead. And then compare the reaction of the Christian world to that one killing, with the reaction of the Muslim world to all the terror attacks. Pew Global Research keeps statistics on the number of Muslims who approve of terror attacks. Look here: http://pewglobal.org/2005/07/14/islamic-extremism-common-concern-for-muslim-and-western-publics/. Now show me the comparable statistics of Christians who approve murdering abortionists. Take your time. We’ll wait.
And this: “You love guns. You love war. You hate people who are different than you. You want to rid the world of liberal scum.”
Delusional.
We don’t love guns; in adult fashion, we recognize that there exists a valid use for them. We don’t love war; we hate it, but in adult fashion, we recognize that there exists a valid use for it. We don’t hate people who are different from us; we accept them, so long as they respect law.
You, on the other hand, do hate those who think unlike you, as evidenced by this little hate rant of yours, not to mention the sheer, irrational vitriol hurled at women or blacks who don’t toe the Progressive line.
“Use this time for some self reflection.” Uttered by a Progressive, who, like all progressives, lacks the ability altogether to examine themselves objectively.
One thing you’re correct about, though; we do agree that it would be a far better world if there were no “liberal scum” in it.
(Unrelated to this topic, please visit my political blog, “Plumb Bob Blog: Squaring the Culture,” at http://www.plumbbobblog.com. Thanks.)
Muslim carnage in Norway
solidspine Sunday, July 24th at 12:04AM EST (link)Muslim websites and news reports are ecstatic, proudly defending these muslim like actions in Norway.
Muslims could not be happier that their past behaviors have motivated more frenzied muslim inspired carnage in a peaceful non-arab, non-muslim country.
Again and as usual shame on muslims, shame on islam, allah be dammed to hell.
Muslims had nothing to do with what happened in Norway
izoneguy (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 12:08AM EST (link)Norwegian Terror Suspect Has ‘Admitted Responsibility’ For Attacks, Lawyer Says
The point cannot be made often enough: Modern liberalism, as embodied in the Obama presidency, is the defender of the status quo. And the status quo is a road to economic ruin. Political forces cannot redistribute the wealth that the economic system does not produce.
you are right Izoneguy
Doc Holliday (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 12:53AM EST (link)but those in the MSM, those on the net, those on the left and right; are wrong beyond redemption to ascribe any political motivation or blame any political theory for what happened.
What happened in Norway was murder full stop. Anyone of any party that tries to defend, blame, or explain it through the lens of philosophy is on a fool’s errand.
The murderer should not be remembered or commented upon, those poor souls that were lost are all that matters. The only societal impact I can see is a further threat to liberty, and that is a real danger. If the Norwegians learn anything from such mindless slaughter, it is that they must do a better job of protecting their citizens. The end result must be that that criminal is checked, not the law abiding citizen.
Molon Labe!
Oh really? You think the Muslims weren't there?
rowdydfw Sunday, July 24th at 4:21PM EST (link)Did you know this very time there were IN FACT the leaders of the Breslan massacres in OSLO…two representatives of the Chechen emirate…negotiating a peace agreement with the progressive Norwwegian party’s Ivar Amundsen as the assassination in fact was being carried out? In fact the progressives were trying to cook up a deal with the Muslim Emirates they could force on the conservative Norwegians?
Did you know that on other websites that Breivik previously claimed ties with the Progressive Party of Norway?
And NOW all of a sudden he’s a Christian conservative islamophobe? Who wrote this grand manifesto of hate under an anonymous name?
And now we have this young man with a lawyer spouting out this nonsense when it really doesn’t matter because Breivnik is only facing 21 years of prison time. And he’s going to get off so easily after murdering so many?
I think that’s just a little bit MUCH to be a coincidence.
Oh really? You think the Muslims weren't there?
rowdydfw Sunday, July 24th at 4:21PM EST (link)Did you know this very time there were IN FACT the leaders of the Breslan massacres in OSLO…two representatives of the Chechen emirate…negotiating a peace agreement with the progressive Norwwegian party’s Ivar Amundsen as the assassination in fact was being carried out? In fact the progressives were trying to cook up a deal with the Muslim Emirates they could force on the conservative Norwegians?
Did you know that on other websites that Breivik previously claimed ties with the Progressive Party of Norway?
And NOW all of a sudden he’s a Christian conservative islamophobe? Who wrote this grand manifesto of hate under an anonymous name?
And now we have this young man with a lawyer spouting out this nonsense when it really doesn’t matter because Breivnik is only facing 21 years of prison time. And he’s going to get off so easily after murdering so many?
I think that’s just a little bit MUCH to be a coincidence.
Manifesto apparently written by Breivik?
1stRichard (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 6:57PM EST (link)There is false information going around confusing Fjordman, an anonymous Norwegian seemingly conservative blogger with Anders Behring Breivik and an alleged manifesto that is not a manifesto but a series of articles mostly from Fjordman.
See…. http://kleinverzet.blogspot.com/
Also below
You, sir, are betraying yourself as a racist
BigRedConservative (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 4:42PM EST (link)Even when Islam is completely innocent, you attempt to castigate it and insult it. Specifically there was no need to say “Allah be damned to hell”, which is an insult beyond anything for Muslims. Please refrain from ad religio</i. attacks.
And two and two always makes a five
It’s the devil’s way now
There is no way out
You can scream and you can shout
It is too late now
Radiohead
Just what race are all them Muslims, Sparky?
Tbone (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 4:48PM EST (link)Now, the guy may be a bigot but I don’t think he is a racist based on this post.
I would say you owe him an apology for calling him a racist.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
All right, he ain't a racist
BigRedConservative (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:05PM EST (link)Just a bigoted provocative blinkered fool with no understanding of foreign religion. I apologize.
Feel better now?
And two and two always makes a five
It’s the devil’s way now
There is no way out
You can scream and you can shout
It is too late now
Radiohead
BigRedConservative- I take issue
Scope (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:23PM EST (link)with your position. You knock someone because you believe they have no knowledge of foreign religion. You’ve claimed ownership to the fact that you spend much time in Europe. Germany, the UK, France have all made harsh and realistic statements that their diversity plans, in accepting the Islamists were a terrible mistake. Look at what Girt Wilders has been saying, and warning the US about for some time. The radical Islamists are becoming a worldwide dangerous lot. Perhaps you have a shaded or foggy view of those in the US that have in fact paid very close attention to the fact that the radicals want to kill the American infidels, namely wnyone in the US that does not follow the Muslim religion. It has been said, and is so very true, political correctness will get us all killed. I would not count on you to cover my back in a fight against the radical terrorists. They do not believe in political correctness.
Yes, better. But perhaps his school didn't offer a course in
Tbone (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 7:45PM EST (link)“foreign religion”. I know mine didn’t and it had a whole theology department.
Also, would you say bigotry is an emotional or intellectual response to people who hang 8 year olds, stone people for adultery, murder their sisters for dating non-Muslims and generally blowing up and shooting innocent people as a form of communication?
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
I don't think you have...
rangerwife Monday, July 25th at 10:14AM EST (link)any understanding of foreign religion if you defend Islam. Would you like to hear some stories of how Muslims treat little boys and goats when they aren’t married? Please…
my husband has been to Iraq and Afghanistan several times and saw things first hand done in the name of Allah that would make you cry yourself to sleep. It’s a political ideology, not a religion and it should be damned to hell. Call me a racist if you want, it only shows YOUR ignorance.
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” — George Orwell
BigRedConservative- Perhaps the UN
Scope (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:13PM EST (link)human rights council can step in and plead leniency because the killer admitted to the deed, but doesn’t feel that he committed any crime. In his manifesto he had problems with immigration, and didn’t feel that the Norweign leaders were doing enough about it. Who is the biggest group immigrating to Norway, the Muslims.
He's also not a conservative
chipbennett (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 11:54AM EST (link)The Oslo terrorist self-identified as a Nazi.
Socialist</em. != conservative
I know the left like to continue to perpetuate the untruth that Nazis were right-wing. Unfortunately for them, we still have their beliefs in Hitler’s own words, and at least 15 out of 25 points in the platform are solidly, nakedly, statist-socialist.
That is what I thought.
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 11:59AM EST (link)Then why is even Fox reporting him as a conservative or “right-winger?”
What has happened to journalism in this country?
I think it goes like this.
msctex (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:46PM EST (link)Nazi = Far Right Wing, & Right Wing = Conservative
One of the greatest, most glaring lies of the Left which has been allowed to flourish without sufficient attack is that the Socialist/Fascist* Nazi Party were in any way “Right Wing.” The only logic which can begin to support the idea of Hitler having a political commonality with Ronald Reagan is to note that both Socialism and Fascism are respectively to the Right of Communism. And in much of Europe in the early to mid-20th century, those were the choices on the table.
*I’ve learned to ascribe an element of Fascism to the Socialist German Workers Party, lest a three-day semantic argument among Poli-Sci majors ensue.
The Russians ascribed Nazism to the Right Wing
Raven (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:00PM EST (link)Because they had to dissociate it from the Left Wing and Socialism. Left Wingers around the globe assisted in this while the right-wingers were busy doing real work and not paying much attention.
“If you do not have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.”
Luke 22:36
Raven is dead on the target here.
Flagstaff (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:33PM EST (link)Is that too violent a metaphor?
The difference between National socialism (Naziism) and World socialism (Communism) is its geographical emphasis. Because of the more local nature of Naziism, it was best supported by a fascistic form of governmental/economic interface. It would also have been more successful (without Hitler’s militaristic bent) than Communism, because fascism leaves most business decisions to businessmen, not bureaucrats.
This is also the path that Obama would follow if he could. It’s what he did with GM. Not practical for health care, because it’s too distributed, so he’s gone with straight government control there.
Whether O is a socialist or not, he’s definitely a fascist. Funny, because that’s what the Left liked to call Bush.
“The press is so powerful in its image-making role that it can make a criminal look like he’s the victim and make the victim look like he’s the criminal. If you aren’t careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.”– Malcolm X, Audubon Ballroom, December 13, 1964
"Fascist," in everyday use. . .
msctex (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:49PM EST (link). . .now means anyone obsessed with power over others, in a any scenario. This is miles from its accurate definition, and as your post indicates, the discussion over the truest definition could go on for days. (Really. I’ve seen it online too many times. For Political Science majors, it’s like arguing Beatles versus Stones.)
My original point is, I think, still the most important. Allowing Nazism to be associated with our side of the aisle, when the antidote is a simple, “Now how could that be true,” or the like, is on the long list of capital “L” Lies which need to be addressed, in order for people who should know better TO know better.
You are right,
Flagstaff (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:49PM EST (link)of course.
“The press is so powerful in its image-making role that it can make a criminal look like he’s the victim and make the victim look like he’s the criminal. If you aren’t careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.”– Malcolm X, Audubon Ballroom, December 13, 1964
From socialism to socialism
1stRichard (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 4:04PM EST (link)Anton Drexler at a workers union meeting said, “I am a socialist like yourselves, and want manual workers to gain equality…” and with this, the Union members bought in to the populist rhetoric ignoring what direction this was going to take them. Former locksmith Anton Drexler and Karl Harrer founded the German Workers Party (DAF). Adolf Hitler joined The German Workers Party making a note of his similar socialist ideology to gain power and with Hitler being a distinguished speaker who drew large crowds. Anton Drexler and Adolf Hitler went on to write the 25 points of the Program of the NSDAP – The National Socialist Workers’ Party from a Labour Union.
On one side was the Social Democratic Labour Party, Bolsheviks (not communists) on the left and the Socialist Workers Party, Nazi on the right. As the name suggests they are both socialist with the left declaring them selves as international socialists and the right declaring them selves as nationalist socialists. Fascism is mostly a distracter and propaganda to dissociate Bolsheviks from Nazis, the Socialist Workers Party was more Nationalism of which is an important part of the Social Democratic Labour Party.
I found this
gunslingr45 Monday, July 25th at 9:46AM EST (link)on left leaning ask.com
The National Socialist German Workers’ Party (German: Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (help•info), abbreviated NSDAP), commonly known in English as the Nazi Party, was a political party in Germany between 1919 and 1945. It was known as the German Workers’ Party (DAP) prior to a change of name in 1920. The term Nazi is German and stems from Nationalsozialist[4], due to the pronunciation of Latin -tion- as -tsion- in German (rather than -shon- as it is in English), with German Z being pronunced as ‘ts’ as well.
They WERE socialist/commies, just of a different color is all.
“Main stream Liberal News media” You can fill volumes with what they don’t report. Which is to say the truth.
Like the rest of the Big Media,
Flagstaff (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:36PM EST (link)Fox is lazy about terminology. If CNN calls something “right-wing,” Fox does too. Doesn’t matter if it’s accurate.
“The press is so powerful in its image-making role that it can make a criminal look like he’s the victim and make the victim look like he’s the criminal. If you aren’t careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.”– Malcolm X, Audubon Ballroom, December 13, 1964
It's a red herring.
Menlo (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 10:43PM EST (link)How far to the left or right one is has nothing to do with one’s inclination to inflict death and physical harm. Being extreme in terms of ideological philosophy is different from being extreme in terms of penalties or punishment. Violence and brutality, whether by government or individuals, is itself neither “right” nor “left.”
“The ultimate touchstone of constitutionality is the Constitution itself and not what we have said about it.” -Felix Frankfurter
This is not correct
Plumb_Bob (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 11:12AM EST (link)Menlo wrote: ‘Violence and brutality, whether by government or individuals, is itself neither “right” nor “left.”’
True, but there is a very solid correlation between one’s political leaning and the likelihood that one is going to engage in disruptive political behavior. So far, virtually all the disruption comes from the left. Disruption is one of their favorite tactics. More than that, the strategy of disruption takes things to a different level; they actually plan to produce societal chaos in order to justify taking over.
No conservative in America would ever conceive of such a thing. Conservatives will only take up arms and commit acts of violence on extreme provocation: either (1) literal insanity, or (2) direct threat to life. And while it was people who believed like modern conservatives who defied Britain and won independence through military effort, It is not certain that today’s conservatives will rise to defend their liberties when directly threatened by tyrants.
(Unrelated to this topic, please visit my political blog, “Plumb Bob Blog: Squaring the Culture,” at http://www.plumbbobblog.com. Thanks.)
Sorry, no.
msctex (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 12:54PM EST (link)The history of the 20th Century offers too much proof to the contrary.
There are no mass murders on the part of Government directly ascribable to Free Market Capitalism, and the true “Right.”. There are hundreds of millions of lives lost directly ascribable to the failings of the various incarnations of Collectivism, or the “Left.”
I understand the point you are trying to make, but there is simply too much overwhelming evidence to the contrary. The numbers are too high.
It's not part of either philosophy.
Menlo (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 9:02PM EST (link)What provokes such violence is not an inherent aspect of capitalism or socialism. Whether it has overwhelmingly come from people who side with one is irrelevant with regard to the economic philosophy.
The ends one wishes to achieve are independent from the means one uses to achieve them.
What’s more, looking to history more than 25-30 years ago is mostly comparing apples and oranges. The world has changed a lot, and the definition of “right” and “left” have expanded and become quite subjective in many regards.
“The ultimate touchstone of constitutionality is the Constitution itself and not what we have said about it.” -Felix Frankfurter
You are right: No "conservative Christian" would do this.
conservativecurmudgeon (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 11:59AM EST (link)A maniacal, barbarous, deranged, evil, monster would. I’ll bet he didn’t list himself on Facebook thus.
The fact is this: I can’t think of a single Christian Church tommorow that will sing the praises of this bastard, or a single “Christan” convenience store that will hang his photo on the wall as a Martyr of God, as they do all along the Gaza strip, and throughout the flea-bitten outposts of Radical Islam. Our murderers are scorned. Islams’ seem to be praised and offered up as pure examples before “Alah”.
No, this disgusting filth will rightfully be scorned, and denounced, and condemened in Churches as the very antithesis of what Christ Jesus taught– and that he is an example of an extremely fallen, sick and depraved world that He came into to save.
I will also say this: The story is not yet written. As J. Edgar Hoover said to RFK when he first told him about his brothers’ assassination, “we are endeavoring to get details”…
Be ready...
chipbennett (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:07PM EST (link)…for the barrage of claims that you’ve just invoked the “No True Scotsman” logical fallacy.
Of course, you’re preempted such claims by demonstrating that the actions of the Oslo terrorist are utterly incongruous with the beliefs of both conservatism and Christianity.
Great post Erick.
jmimac351 Saturday, July 23rd at 12:09PM EST (link)Really, really good.
This is the kind of truth that will cause liberals to spontaneously combust. When one understands this about liberals it helps to understand their mental state, and how it is quite unlikely most of them can be reached and reasoned with. Their twisted belief system is applied to the decisions they make in life. The fruits of those decisions are based on, and result in, more anger and rage – which we see so often why trying to reason with liberals.
This post is why liberalism cannot be reasoned with – it must be defeated outright. Liberals will not compromise. They will always strive to their goals – which I believe are based in Evil. Period.
It’s quite sad when you realize so many are Lost.
But for the grace of God, there go I...nt.
NightTwister (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:16PM EST (link)n/t
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter. – Winston Churchill
Sola gratia has kept this sinner as well from performing countless murders most foul
CincoSolas_del_Bronx (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 1:34PM EST (link)which, though hidden to the magistrates of this world, were most offensively visible to the Judge of all flesh, and necessitated an even more grievous blood-letting than anything that will ever be seen.
When will the professing Christians at this site acknowledge that the tolerance of many here for ridicule, slander and curses is under the judgment of Christ as equivalent to murder? Until that perspective is repented of, they should not be surprised that a watching world accuses them of hypocrisy at times such as these. One fears they really don’t believe that the grace which alone covers their own sin is powerful enough to justify the sins of their enemies as well; if they did, they would be more concerned about conveying the truth of that message than fretting that they have been misjudged.
I’m going back down–I’ve never enjoyed Endor at this time of year.
Those dreading urbanization should remember that though the Kingdom of God first appeared in a temporal Garden, at the end of the book it is established in an eternal City. (paraphrase, James M. Boice)
soli Deo gloria
Well stated, sir
civil truth (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 8:15PM EST (link)A bit prolix, but a needed call to gracious action on our parts in the midst of our fighting against wickedness in high places.
The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis
http://www.gmsplace.com/
Maybe you would like to rethink your statement,
kajun Saturday, July 23rd at 12:24PM EST (link)“Never mind that a conservative Christian would not do what the guy did.” (last paragraph)
By having a ‘title’ of conservative Christian doesn’t exclude anyone from doing anything, right or wrong. We’re all flesh and blood and we’re all vulnerable to doing things you wouldn’t be expected to do. Remember a guy named Judas? One of the ‘original’ 12 disciples, you just wouldn’t expect him to betray Christ, and yet he did. Only one man has been able to turn down any and all temptations and that of course was Christ.
Not trying to get ‘preachy’ but I do enjoy your blog and wanted to suggest that maybe your ‘proof-reader’ missed this one.
And besides, ‘Never mind that a conservative Blogger would not say what this one said’. LOL.
Keep fighting the good fight and pressing onward to the goal which lays before us.
kaj
Oh, please.
msctex (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:33PM EST (link)I’m not religious, but Erick is right. No hypothetical individual who truly qualifies as a Conservative Christian would ever even consider doing such a thing. His beliefs as such would preclude the possibility. No sane person is “vulnerable” to this sort of thing. There is either mental illness or an abhorrent system of mistaken beliefs at play, in every instance.
Amen, mstex
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:57PM EST (link)People who are Christians do make mistakes, none of us our perfect. But we do NOT roll over one day and decide to go on a shooting rampage, murdering innocent people. It goes against absolutely everything that our faith stands for.
Kajun, I will ” preach” a little hear too. There are many verses in the Bible that refer to people who call themselves Christians and who are not. Jesus said that the world would know us as His disciples based on how we loved one another. He also stated that Christians would be known by the fruit they bear in their lives. Call me crazy, but I do not think that mass murdering innocent people is indicative of good Christian fruit? Do you?
By the way, Judas is by no means held up as a disciple who ” fell away” in the
Bible. I am sorry, but your post just comes across as insulting in the wake of this tragedy.
Er, Judas was Jewish
BigRedConservative (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 1:26PM EST (link)Just sayin’
And two and two always makes a five
It’s the devil’s way now
There is no way out
You can scream and you can shout
It is too late now
Radiohead
And your point is?
civil truth (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 8:11PM EST (link)If I recall, Simon (Peter), Andrew, James, John, Phillip, Bartholomew, Thomas, Matthew, James (2), Lebbaeus, Simon (2), Joseph, Matthias, for starters, were also Jewish. And Saul (Paul), and countless other followers of Jesus. Not to mention Jesus himself was Jewish.
Again I’d ask, what is your point, keeping in mind the site rules?
The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis
http://www.gmsplace.com/
How do you brush your teeth without poking out your eye?
Tbone (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:13PM EST (link)Are you really this devoid of logic and reason?
You said: “By having a ‘title’ of conservative Christian doesn’t exclude anyone from doing anything, right or wrong. ” Well no foolin’.
However by actually being a Christian does preclude someone from killing from 1 to 90 people at a time. That is the point. The MSM is calling this guy something he can’t be by definition.
Would calling him a Christian woman make any sense? No, Sparky because even you might guess he is not a woman. Well, he ain’t a Christian either. Now come back when you have attained a level of cognizant thought past that of a sweet pea.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
Sometimes you annoy me w/ some of your comments
Ann_W (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:37PM EST (link)But this was very good, and precisely what needed to be said. And it made my LOL a little.
“One of the great mistakes is to judge policies and programs by their intentions rather than their results.”
— Milton Friedman
The War on Poverty– forty-six years and counting!
That's the way it is supposed to work.
Tbone (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 2:22PM EST (link)nt
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
A nut or a sociopath?
DonPMitchell (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:39PM EST (link)Violence of this type seems to stem from two phenomena, either an unbalanced mind that becomes radicalized, or an opportunistic sociopath who takes advantage of radical ideas. It’s not about islam or christianity, because pretty much any zealous system of thought will do. In Britain, they have trouble with violent animal rights activism. It all boils down to two things: people who are crazy, or people who will do anything to get some power.
If there is a lesson about religions here, it is that we cannot paint a whole religion with one brush, based on the actions of nuts or sociopaths. Most people in the world just want to live their life and take care of their families. It’s not healthy to spin this story to be about christianity vs. islam.
Goldwater: In your heart, you know he’s right
Check the facts
1stRichard (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:47PM EST (link)The European political spectrum (Oslo) consists of the Social Democratic Labour Party on the left and the Socialist Workers Party on the right as the extremes. Here in the US as declared in our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution took the exceptional direction of less government. The left here is actually the Social Democratic Labour Party and the Socialist Workers Party, or any more government types. The Socialist Workers Party most definitely used the government controlled church for propaganda as self-declared Christian fundamentalists and not true Christians.
However, these facts will not deter those on the left to link the Tea Party, Conservatives and Republicans to Oslo. Let the blame game begin…..
So glad you made that point!
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 1:05PM EST (link)My sister just made that point this morning. She was making the point that you cannot apply their politics too ours. I was not sure of the details of their political system, but I was fairly sure it was quite different. The reality is that both are Leftist parties, calling themselves Christian-in-name only.
1stRichard, you seem well-versed on this issue, you may want to consider writing a diary on it. I think it is very important to realize that other people’s politics are quite different from ours.
A diary on it?
1stRichard (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 2:30PM EST (link)I think it would be best to point toward the information. This is huge topic, once a political faction controls any social group there is distortion and treason, which can only end in a distorted faction. This not only includes Church but also Unions and Schools. This is the foundation of socialism, to destroy individual morality and conscience, and change it to an easily controlled collectivist sum. I am not aware of any one book that fully encompasses this topic as most concentrate on one regime of socialism, if you do please reply.
No worries, my only intent was to compliment
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 2:53PM EST (link)you on being the first one to point out that Norway’s politics are much different from ours and that there are many parties at work in that country; all of which have some element of statism, if not socialism in them.
With regards to the diary, I was not referring to the insidious growth of socialism in society, but rather that Norway’s geopolitical landscape is much different from what we in America know.
This is also why discussions of "God" and "Faith" are so elemental to our political discourse,
conservativecurmudgeon (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 12:56PM EST (link)…by the way.
God is envoked by the evil as well as pious. It is up to those that (at least) TRY to live up to a modicum of Christ’s example that we defend the Lord when it is the evil that do the envoking. Otherwise, we scede the ground before the battle is engaged.
Make no mistake: That the left so quickly pounced on the religious-right component of this heartbreaking event is reason enough to engage this political/religious battle at home. God is moving througout the world, and to simply turn away is both dangerous and naive.
I’ve not infrequently seen examples on this fine Web Site of those who engage this battle as somehow hurting the struggle, or distracting from it, or even causing embarassement amongst the comfortably secular elements of conservative Republicanism; I get it. “This is a political, not religious, website”, we are told. But, as the aftermath of (to name two recent examples) both Arizona and Oslo confirm, the face and name of God and politics are inexarable intertwined, and I think it is for the betterment of the Conservative-Traditional-Constitutional Repbulican to not recoil from that reality. It is but a facet of that reality, but a facet, nonetheless.
Anders Behring Breivik Fake Facebook Profile
izoneguy (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 2:13PM EST (link)Anders Behring Breivik Fake Facebook Profile
The point cannot be made often enough: Modern liberalism, as embodied in the Obama presidency, is the defender of the status quo. And the status quo is a road to economic ruin. Political forces cannot redistribute the wealth that the economic system does not produce.
Wow.
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 2:58PM EST (link)If this turns out to be true, the media will once again look ridiculous.
Ironically, Fox news has put up a new story from AP (amended from their earlier one) seemingly walking back the meme that he was affiliated with any right-wing party and are now reporting that the motives are unknown.
The media just does not look ridiculous - they are ridiculous
izoneguy (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:46PM EST (link)A circus reporting on the circus.
I don’t trust politicians or the media.
Don’t trust and always verify.
The point cannot be made often enough: Modern liberalism, as embodied in the Obama presidency, is the defender of the status quo. And the status quo is a road to economic ruin. Political forces cannot redistribute the wealth that the economic system does not produce.
Exactly
runner12 (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 4:08PM EST (link)NT
Who Added "Christian" and "Conservative" to Norway Shooter's Facebook Page Yesterday?
Viator Saturday, July 23rd at 5:05PM EST (link)http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/07/who-added-christian-and-conservative-to-norway-shooters-facebook-page-yesterday.html
The same person who deleted
blooch Saturday, July 23rd at 10:34PM EST (link)U K L Lee from his Friends list.
“Lieutenant Dike wasn’t a bad leader because he made bad decisions. He was a bad leader because he made no decisions.”
It really isn't all that hard to figure out, Erick,
romeg Saturday, July 23rd at 2:25PM EST (link)why they would demonize anyone connected to “The Right” while contorting themselves into a pretzel to avoid identifying anyone not so connected: They KNOW beyond a fact certain that WE will never support them or their reckless schemes while they fervently hope that, maybe, there is some slim chance that the ‘Others’ might, someday, sort of not want to do them in and maybe even support them. THAT is what passes for Reasonableness on the part of the Left.
“Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.” – C. S. Lewis
And I have to add this:
romeg Saturday, July 23rd at 2:34PM EST (link)Just because a guy has a Facebook page on which he self-identifies as a Christian does not, in fact, make him a Christian. Many people claim to be things that they, in fact, are not.
We see similar behavior in our own elective politics: Candidates claiming to be Tea Party supporters when they are, in fact, liberal Democrats seeking to divide the Republican vote.
“Ye shall know them by their works.”
I, personally, am unaware of Christians going around and murdering people or even thinking that it might be a way to accomplish God’s Will.
But that’s just me.
“Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.” – C. S. Lewis
Beat me to it
Raven (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 3:13PM EST (link)I was also going to point out that the facebook page proves nothing but that there was a facebook page. How do we know he was the one who set it up and/or maintained it? Is it the Same person (same name means little)? What was he in real life (other than a murderous monster)?
And, as a slightly earlier post pointed out, the facebook page is now being reported as a fake.
http://www.solidprinciples.com/blog/anders-behring-breivik-facebook-profile-a-fake/
“If you do not have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.”
Luke 22:36
No Sane Person
spinoneone Saturday, July 23rd at 4:03PM EST (link)of either the Christian or Jewish persuasion would pick-up several weapons and shoot innocent young men and women. Nor would that sane person plant a bomb in the middle of anywhere with the intent of simply killing as many as possible.
The only significant difference between the Nazis and the Communists in 1938 was that the Nazis and the rest of the Fascist parties allowed limited private ownership of the means of production, specifically, small business and farming. The Nazis in Germany pretty much controlled what companies employing more than 500 people could produce and at what cost, especially with respect to Government contracts. Both the Nazis and the Commies were totalitarian, single party states. Joe and Hitler were in agreement on most things until Hitler decided he needed more room and more raw materials for his war.
No sane person of any faith indeed
BigRedConservative (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 5:09PM EST (link)Only a godless man or a man with an irreparably distorted view of God would do such a thing. There is a special corner of Dante’s Inferno reserved for these sub-human freaks.
And two and two always makes a five
It’s the devil’s way now
There is no way out
You can scream and you can shout
It is too late now
Radiohead
If what he believed was Christianity then I'm not a Christian
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 4:21PM EST (link)I’m a gun owner and also a Christian, although I’m not very observant in terms of attending church. But nevertheless nothing that this man did has anything to do with my views on gun ownership or Christianity.
I think we need a much fuller discussion of this. I’m happy to contribute to that discussion, because as a gun owner and an advocate for 2nd Amendment rights and also a baptized Roman Catholic (albeit a bit lapsed) I think I could offer some intelligent thoughts on the subject.
It’s impossible to call this man a Christian. His crimes are political. He’s a political desperado and a murderer of innocent children. Everything he has done is diametrically opposed to everything I believe and my friends believe. And yet the label persists.
It would be much more honest if the New York Times referred to him as a self-created Christian apostate.
Defend Liberty — Join the NRA | Live in Massachusetts? Join GOAL.
As far as "gun loving" is concerned
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 4:54PM EST (link)Which is one of the other colorful modifiers the NYT has there on its front page, I can say this: I’m much less afraid of people who *tell me* they’re gun owners than the ones who want to conceal it for some reason or another. By all indications, this guy did everything he could to conceal what he was doing.
Y’all at Redstate and elsewhere can come and have a look at mine any time you’d like.
Defend Liberty — Join the NRA | Live in Massachusetts? Join GOAL.
I used to wonder what kowalski meant here at RedState.
Ann_W (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:43PM EST (link)Now, it’s fun to see it in person. You’re a noun, a legend.
Good points, too.
“One of the great mistakes is to judge policies and programs by their intentions rather than their results.”
— Milton Friedman
The War on Poverty– forty-six years and counting!
Thanks, Ann_W
kowalski (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 2:21PM EST (link)They are as per my usual, stream of consciousness comments as pure as I could make them. I’m certainly not ideologically “pure” here on Redstate or anywhere else. Erick Erickson himself has contacted me privately in the past and admonished me (as only Erick can) to “suck it up, Kowalski!” And I thank him for that because at the time it was well deserved.
I contribute my thoughts here because in large measure I’m right-of-center but I have my own views on a lot of things that don’t map point-to-point with anyone elses. I debate these things consciously and subconsciously all the time.
Owning firearms and shooting firearms has been something I’ve done since I was in high school and there are certainly things about it that give me pause when I think about them long enough, just as if you stare at your own hand long enough you can come to think it’s slightly alien and yet it’s also a part of you. Does that make sense in a short description? That’s how I think of it. I cherish and defend my right to do so. But I’m also aware of all the things that go along with it. Most of them are positive in my experience.
In any case, I feel feel genuine empathy for the entire nation of Norway and I know that this nightmarish episode has already caused tremendous pain and now it will cause a tremendous amount of soul-searching and debate.
All that I can say is that I wish I had been there on the island, in close proximity to this monster, with my gun. I know what I would have done, without any hesitation. That’s another thing that the Norwegians need to consider. They’re a considerate people and I know they will.
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As far as being a "legend" is concerned
kowalski (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 2:24PM EST (link)I didn’t choose that, but once it happened I realized I was in no position to stop it, so the best thing was to embrace it, which I do. And I appreciate it.
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My first guess as to the perpatrator...
ThePoliticalHat Saturday, July 23rd at 5:26PM EST (link)…was that it was a “Black Metal” type.
I’m not surprised that it wasn’t though, as the Oslo attacks weren’t aimed at churches, and instead at the secular power establishment.
Yeah, me too
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 5:38PM EST (link)I thought for a while it might be something like that, but the attacks showed a very high degree of coordination and skill. The “black metal” guys are too drunk for that. This was a policical crime wrapped up in a twisted Christian fundamentalist shell, perpetrated by a careful and intelligent loner. Truthfully the “black metal’ people don’t have anything to worry about in Norway except the occasional bout of seasonal affective disorder – Norway is so generous as a social welfare state that everyone is taken care of. They can rage on and on about the frozen landscape of death but generally speaking they calm down after a while.
And I don’t begrudge the Norwegians their Socialism – it works for them, almost all of them agree on it, it’s the path they’ve chosen, and by all accounts they’re happy with it. It’s a pretty country. I dated a girl from Norway, a long time ago. she was a wonderful human being. I might have married her if she wasn’t so determined to return.
No, this was a guy who just decided he was going to singlehandledly try to alter that with an act of horrific violence and guess what? That isn’t going to work. Norway was Socialist two days ago and it will be Socialist even more tomorrow. The Norwegians protect that system and their way of life with great care and skill and I see no reason not to live and let them live with it.
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It is actually a little surprising to me
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 5:52PM EST (link)Norway is very strict already regarding its immigration policies and residency requirements. You can find them on Norway’s official websites. You either are willing to live there and abide by their system for a long period of time and learn their language and agree to contribute to their socialist system or you get out.
This guy should have gotten out a long time ago. It would have been much better for the entire world, Christians and Muslims and everyone else, if he had just realized he didn’t like where he lived and decided to leave. Perhaps Norway should be looking at finding more people who should leave rather than stay: those are the ones they should be worried about.
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Socialism Can Cause "Black Death Metal Music"
Ausonius (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:16PM EST (link)The reaction to a socialized life, where things are planned for you, where your freedom is restricted, where you are not allowed to become too different, where mediocrity is the best you are allowed to achieve, and where radical pacifism frowns upon any logical self-defense, one response is to scream in epic frustration and toy with Death itself to relieve the regimented boredom of such a life.
In earlier days, when Scandinavians were more adventurous and less lulled into somnabulism by their Socialist societies, they packed up and left for the prairies of Minnesota.
Ausonius: 310-395 A.D. Teacher, Poet, Consul, General, Farmer.
Personal Tutor to the future St. Paulinus of Nola and to young Gratian, heir to the throne during the turbulent final years of the Western Roman Empire. When his former student Gratian was assassinated, Ausonius threw up his hands and retired to his farm in Gaul. Rome was captured by barbarians 14 years after his death.
Cato@rock.com
Well the enormous control
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:23PM EST (link)The enormous control that managed societies inflict upon people is not something people who live there should be forced to deal with. I much prefer our system even though there are many fewer guarantees. That’s my personality, that’s who I am. I think Norway is a very small group of people who basically agree all on the same political arrangement within a set of very narrow parameters. I could not live that way and that’s why I didn’t go.
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Scandinavian Socialism Is Cracking Apart
Ausonius (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:49PM EST (link)And “Norwegian Black Metal “Music” ” is just one symptom. Norway’s “success” depends heavily on North Sea oil propping everything up.
Take a look at this essay about the myth of the success of Scandinavian Socialism:
http://mises.org/Community/forums/t/5616.aspx
An excerpt:
“NORWAY: LOWER LIVING STANDARDS THAN THE US
Here is one more thing of interest to everyone interested in living standards in Scandinavian countries vs. the US. First, according to the International Monetary Fund, the World Bank, and the CIA World Factbook, the USA has a higher GDP per capita than any Scandinavian nation with the exception of Norway. Norway has one of the highest GDP per capita in the world, right after free market paradises such as Luxembourg and Liechtenstein, and oil rich nations such as Qatar and Kuwait.
Although Norway’s GDP per capita seems to be boosted by huge oil and natural gas production, do Norwegians actually enjoy higher living standards than Americans? I dare say that they don’t. A quick look around worldsalaries.org shows that:
1. Americans enjoy higher average disposable (after tax) AND gross (before tax) income than Norwegians do.
2. Americans enjoy a significantly lower cost of living than do Norwegians (1.00 vs. 1.487).”
And for a taste of Norwegian Black Death Metal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4U33U_UyzQ
Ausonius: 310-395 A.D. Teacher, Poet, Consul, General, Farmer.
Personal Tutor to the future St. Paulinus of Nola and to young Gratian, heir to the throne during the turbulent final years of the Western Roman Empire. When his former student Gratian was assassinated, Ausonius threw up his hands and retired to his farm in Gaul. Rome was captured by barbarians 14 years after his death.
Cato@rock.com
I'll look at them.
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:20PM EST (link)In terms of per-capita income Scandinavians have huge penalties but their social welfare systems are something they seem to be willing to accept. While I’m reading yours, you can read this from “Inc.”
http://www.inc.com/magazine/20110201/in-norway-start-ups-say-ja-to-socialism.html
It’s a very small, very rich country. It handpicks what it does very carefully controls its immigration and employment, and it relies most especially on an society-wide agreement that it will stay within those boundaries. It stays away from NATO activities to the greatest extent possible but is still a member of NATO. It enjoys a great deal of protection and social stability because of that. It is the one of the closest things on earth to a true “egg shell community.”
Americans have more disposable income but not right now! Most Americans are figuring out how to pay for their health care, including me. At times like this, in a prolonged recession with people going broke and people getting sick, Socialism in Norway looks mighty good indeed. It’s pleasant. It’s stable. It doesn’t get shocked around by the rest of the world. It is insular and if you want to live there, you have to agree to live in the shell.
But you can’t just go there, any more than you can go to Canada.
Norwegians actually DO NOT enjoy higher living standards than Americans because they surrender so much of their income to the State. They live modestly because they keep next to nothing of that disposable income. But they have made the bargain that the survival of the whole society at a certain level of managed affluence is OK. They think of taxes as paying for services at a very high level. They’re an “OK, we’re doing good” country at a very high price. They are willing to make that bargain as long as their leaders keep it for them.
The Norwegians are probably the least-revolutionary people on the planet. They want stability at all costs. Decent lives, not much conspicuous affluence, high quality education, free healthcare, and really not much flash. That’s Norway.
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Almost all of the European Socialist
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:25PM EST (link)Almost all of the European Socialist objection to George W. Bush and his policies and war in Iraq were based on not destabilizing their relatively placid, socialist economies. They didn’t want to be dragged into a “cowboy” war against the muslims. It turns out that they also have at least one homegrown terrorist but nobody should be surprised by that.
Europe is about Socialist Stability. That’s all they care about. They are willing to sacrifice everything to achieve what they consider to be a stable, sustainable Socialist economy across the entire region.
Nothing this guy in Norway did is going to stop that from happening, it’s just going to hasten it.
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If anything I think
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:36PM EST (link)If anything I think Scandinavian Socialism is going to become much stronger in the near future. Far from cracking apart, I think it is going to become much more resolved after this episode particularly. All societies rally around their core beliefs when they’re assaulted and the Scandinavians aren’t going to be an exception.
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Which is why
kowalski (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:19PM EST (link)Even though Norway’s socialist system exists perfecly well as a thing in itself, there should always be options for people, including: “Get out.”
I was in quasi-love with the girl I dated back in early college and the big question was whether I would repatriate to Norway with her and become a Norwegian. There were a lot of things about it that were attractive, including her.
I decided that was not what I wanted to do and thankfully I had the option of not going. It’s not for everyone and it shouldn’t be.
I have the feeling the more comes out about this guy, the more we’re going to discover that he was terribly disaffected with the society he lived in (as though we haven’t already) but he did have the option to leave instead of murdering something like 100 children and blowing up buildings in Oslo. He didn’t like Norway. There are other places he could have and should have gone. But nobody should dare call him a Christian.
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Both are wrong
jonnymuffin Saturday, July 23rd at 5:59PM EST (link)Trying to make a connection tieing violence to a religion seems silly to me, It’s like trying to treat a symptom instead of the problem. Our current conflict is with people in a region that has a larger muslim population, so naturally the people we are fighting with will be muslim. The perpetrators of 9/11 have stated the reasons for the attacks, and the conspiracy theory that they are lieing doesn’ make sense. The motivations they have stated are America’s support of Isreal’s occupation of Palistine, the USA’s military presence in the middle east, and the USA’s support of Dictators in the region – like Mubarek and Musharraf.
Certianly there are religious factors, but an indepth study of suicide bombing by robert pape backs up the theory that religious beliefs were less important as motivating factors than most people believe. He concludes that the strongest motivation is not religion but rather a desire to “compel modern democracies to withdrawl military forces from territory the terrorist view as their homeland.”
It’s the conclusion that our own CIA has drawn – that 9/11 was ‘blowback’, so you don’t have to be a nut to agree. We would be pissed if a foriegn government occupied and meddled in the affairs of our land. When there is a rational explaination, and an irrational one, I have to assume the rational one over some conspiracy theory.
In the end Terrorist aren’t that much different than Tea Partiers. Both are upset with a US Government that is overreaching and interveening into their lives, and both have religious undertones, we need to realize that despite our differences, we are really on the same side opposing an overbearing state. Trying to make the sole motivation about religion distracts from the root cause just like trying to link the Oslo shooter to religion distracts from his true motivations.
“In the end Terrorist aren’t that much different than Tea Partiers.”
Get off of our website.
Moe Lane (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:21PM EST (link)You aren’t worth a creative banning.
The Kim Kardashian of blogging.
Check out my blog at http://moelane.com/.
http://moelane.com/filthy-lucre-filthy-lucre/
http://twitter.com/moelane
My (combined) wish list.
Thank you Moe
Scope (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:59PM EST (link)from the bottom of my heart. Thank you.
Disagreement
1stRichard (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 6:53PM EST (link)The foundation of socialism is to destroy individual morality and conscience, and change it to an easily controlled collectivist sum. Church, unions, media, schools and such run by a government or faction is used to achieve this, to validate violence. There are collectivist rewards of equalities and protection used to propagate decisions in individual morality and conscience toward more government control. Oslo, as are all in this part of the world are socialist nations with their own versions of left end right as well the definition of Christianity. Here in the US as declared in our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution took the exceptional direction of less government and this is where the Tea Party mostly stands. There is no possible relation or connection between the two. Under his version of fundamentalist Christianity this was a perfectly acceptable action, from what is being reported, neo-Nazi, National Socialist Workers’ Party, their right wing version of Christianity. As we declared our independence from the like of the Church of England, this new direction is uniquely Tea Party, no government control. The Nazi party used their version of Christianity to validate violence, as do others.
Did you say Tea Party wants no government control?
concap (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:10PM EST (link)if so, where did you read this?
The Constitution is neither Right or Left, it is American.
You need neither be Right or Left to vote American.
When you vote on the Federal level based on politics, you are voting for a lobbyist to promote your own personal wants and force them on others through taxation and legislation.
FF/FS/SL/RMIL/OK
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State/Social Local/Retired Military/Oath Keeper
Wow, a short list below
1stRichard (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 10:36PM EST (link)Yes, I have seen most of them, I am one of the original W/Mass Tea Party/9|12 members/organizers. The three largest groups in our Tea Party are Libertarians, Democrats and Classic Liberals. The cutoff point generally adopted by our Tea Party group is Constitutional Center as are most that I have talked with. Anyone to the left of Constitutional center is quickly educated or expelled by the group. We have no problem dealing with infiltration given our location deep behind enemy lines as it is expected.
The Tea Party wants no government control of religion, we have had several debates over that and it is more complicated then no government control. As with most freedoms there are limitations, you do not yell fire in a crowded theater is a general understanding here. There is also a line being drawn here between religion and law, this being religion becoming government thus government control of religion as seen in some Muslim factions. Yes, this may be a bit controversial but given the specific examples, this merits a worthy mention. So, where did I read this, I have thousands of emails on this subject to start with, may be some day it will make a good book.
Munchausen syndrome?
concap (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 11:50AM EST (link)Trying to figure out what kind of conservative you are.
Read all of your past post available in your profile.
You seam to be a little of every conservative there is except for Green.
Which makes you hard to pin down. Put I think that’s the way you want it.
So, if I had to guess, I would say, Socialist?, (which means you can still be a conservative)
Or you suffer from a severe case of Munchausen syndrome, brought on from living in liberal La-La Land, the Happy Valley of moon bats and welfare.
Are you on the list below?
If not, what kind of conservative are you EXACTLY?
Thanks
The Constitution is neither Right or Left, it is American.
You need neither be Right or Left to vote American.
When you vote on the Federal level based on politics, you are voting for a lobbyist to promote your own personal wants and force them on others through taxation and legislation.
FF/FS/SL/RMIL/OK
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State/Social Local/Retired Military/Oath Keeper
Trying to figure it out?
1stRichard (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:36PM EST (link)I think it is part of the Munchausen syndrome, do not let your self be labeled. Personally, on the scale of more government on the left and less government on the right with the Constitution being center I would not call my self a modern conservative. I would be to the right somewhere between Classic Liberal and Libertarian.
What scale are you using to establish someone?
Have you had a chance
concap (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 2:18PM EST (link)to read my profile or signature block?
I did not get much from yours.
The Constitution is neither Right or Left, it is American.
You need neither be Right or Left to vote American.
When you vote on the Federal level based on politics, you are voting for a lobbyist to promote your own personal wants and force them on others through taxation and legislation.
FF/FS/SL/RMIL/OK
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State/Social Local/Retired Military/Oath Keeper
He is a Conservative.
concap (Diary) Saturday, July 23rd at 7:34PM EST (link)He wants things to be the way they use to be in his country.
Yes, a Conservative,
Maybe this will stop Nikitias and others on RS from hiding behind the generic title of Conservative.
Even some of the old communist still in office are trying to conserve the old ways, making them conservatives.
Nikitias is advocating a new Conservative Party.
What kind?
Traditionalist Conservative
Religious conservative
Limited Government Conservative
Nationalist Conservative
Neo Conservative
Paleo Conservative
Libertarian Conservative
Southern Democrat Conservative
Torie Conservative
Modern Conservative
Representative Conservative
Conservative Democrat
Old Right Conservative
Green Conservative
Communist Conservative
Social Conservative
Fiscal Conservative
Constitutional Conservative
There are as many Conservatives’ as there are people.
Every ones agenda is to conserve their basic principles and ideals, making them a Conservative.
This is why the Republican Party is in such disarray. No two members have the same principles or ideals other than right is better than left.
The Republican Party has failed to rally people under the flag of one ideal.
Most of the Tea Party movement is rallying under the flag of Fiscal/Constitutional conservatism, thus making them a more cohesive and definable group of Conservatives.
Over time, the Tea Party, like the Republican Party will be infiltrated and weakened by the opposition, requiring the need for a new Fiscal/Constitutional movement.
In my opinion, if a person is not a Fiscal/Constitutional Conservative ONLY, on a FEDERAL level whether on the left or the right, they are a direct threat to the ideals of this nation and it’s constitution and will be the cause of it’s collapse.
Not every one on RS has a detailed profile.
I think they do this so they can’t be pinned down, thus allowing them to stir the pot, so to speak.
Maybe this in the signature block would help others see where others are coming from and cut down on some of the assumptions and name calling.
FF/SS
Fiscal Federal/Social State Conservative
Or
FF/FS
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State Conservative
Or
SF/SS
Social Federal/Social State Conservative
If you are one of these, feel free to use it.
Or just hide behind———–I’m a Conservative.
If you have FF/SS in your signature block and you type you are in favor of Federal funding for a free home for everyone program, we can call you on it right then and there.
The Constitution is neither Right or Left, it is American.
You need neither be Right or Left to vote American.
When you vote on the Federal level based on politics, you are voting for a lobbyist to promote your own personal wants and force them on others through taxation and legislation.
FF/FS/SL/RMIL/OK
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State/Social Local/Retired Military/Oath Keeper
Erick, you weren't wrong...
rowdydfw Saturday, July 23rd at 9:47PM EST (link)This is one day old! Let this thing play out. It’s already been revealed that the guy was a member of the ‘progressive’ wing of Norwegian politics, he’s no more conservative than Reid or Pelosi.
Second of all, that facebook page was faker than a plug nickel. He’s Norwegian! The facebook page is in English! I have at least 20 f/b friends from foreign countries. Their pages and their walls and their postings are in the languages of their own countries! Unless they’re posting directly to American friends. One of whom is a member of the Kommunistische Partei Österreich (Austria). A Norwegian conservative would have said he is Hoyre! On other sites this guy has stated he’s Fremskrittspartiet i Norge (progressive). The f/b page is a fake! All my f/b foreign friends are pointing out the fake.
Don’t let’s be fooled. The progressives in the US have aligned themselves with Islam to attack conservatism and especially Christians. Much like they have in most foreign countries. Watch the foreign press on this one. The US press is desperate for a Christian conservative terrorist, even if they have to lie to get one! They will hide the facts!
Not even to mention that Christians just DON’T murder children indiscriminately like that. Only the Rebludgeon of Peace goes for children! Because they strike at your biggest fear!
5 Remember Beslan.
blooch Saturday, July 23rd at 10:52PM EST (link)Oh, and coincidentally,
http://www.fox33.com/category/story/?id=159808
“Lieutenant Dike wasn’t a bad leader because he made bad decisions. He was a bad leader because he made no decisions.”
So the Chechen emirates were there...
rowdydfw Sunday, July 24th at 3:36PM EST (link)So, Progressive Norwegian Ivan Amundsen was negotiating with the Breslan massacurers over a peace agreement and the shooter is associated with the Progressive Party of Norway. Who’d a thought it? And everything we’re hearing out of the US media is total BS!
While your busy dis-owning him
skyrous Sunday, July 24th at 12:56AM EST (link)Here’s his video manefesto:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=89a_1311444384
And heres where you can get the text version:
https://hotfile.com/dl/124843184/2315d8e/2083-AEuropeanDeclarationofIndependence.docx.html
The short version marxists and islamist want destroy the western world. Gee where have I heard this before?
clean up
Doc Holliday (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:01AM EST (link)we are “disowning him”? clean up guys
Molon Labe!
btw, you have a lot of freaking nerve and no
Doc Holliday (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:03AM EST (link)gonads to be using the deaths of others to try to score a political point. You really need to get a handle on what your life has become.
Molon Labe!
Both of those links have a pay to play.
gekster (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:14AM EST (link)I guess idiots can’t help themselves.
And a killers manefesto is never any good.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
Series of articles not a manifesto
1stRichard (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 9:52AM EST (link)Mosty from Fjordman, an anonymous Norwegian blogger, how are you making the connection?
Found it!
1stRichard (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 10:08AM EST (link)“”"”"”"”UPDATE001] There is a vicious rumour going around that Fjordman is the Oslo shooter named Anders Breivik. Sites like LGF are gleefully running with this.
IT IS NOT TRUE
From Gates of Vienna:
I was in conversation with Fjordman all day today, starting before the shootings, during the slaughter, and afterwards. If he was shooting up Utøya, he was doing an amazing job of communicating with his friends the whole time, even after he was thrown in a jail cell.
I am surprised and quite shocked that anyone, who’s has read any of the FF’s would even entertain the thought that Fjordman would be capable of something like this atrocity. Fjordman does not deserve this. Anyone spreading the rumour is, by that action, saying more about his/her own loathsome character.
[UPDATE002] Posted on GoV, on 23 July 2011, over 24hrs AFTER the Oslo atrocity:
I notice that certain bloggers such as Charles Johnson of Little Green Footballs keep spreading the utterly false rumor that I am the evil shooter from Utøya, the island just outside of Oslo.
I have absolutely no idea who planted that rumor or for what reason, but they obviously don’t wish me well. For the record, I was live-blogging about these horrible events the entire Friday evening, which can be confirmed by nearly a dozen different individuals.
I didn’t respond to these rumors earlier because I was too emotionally exhausted from yesterday’s events. It was hard to pay attention to such things, but now I feel that I must. Some people really do want to smear me that badly.
Let that be an end to the matter.”"”"”"”"”
http://kleinverzet.blogspot.com/
I wonder if a lack of civil discourse in Norway caused this tragedy
SoFiMil (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 6:18AM EST (link)My prayers are with our brothers and sisters in Norway.
www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com
Obvious
locomotivebreath1901 Sunday, July 24th at 10:00AM EST (link)Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason.
And I’m very confident this pile of dog squeeze did not go around yelling “Jesus Akbar” as he murdered all those children.
Signature:
The 'Christian Conservative' listing on his Facebook may have been added AFTER his arrest
michaelo Sunday, July 24th at 1:20PM EST (link)http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/07/who-added-christian-and-conservative-to-norway-shooters-facebook-page-yesterday.html
The nutcase in Norway was definitively Anti-Muslim and a neo-Nazi type, but calling him a ‘Christian fundamentalist’ seems to ONLY be supported a Facebook entry (and we’ve heard of no church he attended, in a country where church attendance is very light- until the last few days). Now is appears ‘Christian Conservative’ was added to his Facebook page AFTER he was captured.
Change Of Heart
morristhewise (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 1:35PM EST (link)The voice of Racism at Oslo was loud and clear. But that voice will be quieted as the killer spends years in his prison cell. The only sound will be the sound of his voice asking the guard to open the gate, so he can spend some time in the prison yard. He would gladly accept Multiculturalism if given a few less years of prison time.
Mattress Sharing
morristhewise (Diary) Sunday, July 24th at 5:05PM EST (link)There was nothing the Oslo shooter hated more than the thought of having to share his living space with a person of color. His worse thoughts are going to become a reality as prison authorities force him to share a mattress with a dark-skinned sexual outlaw. Both will be released after 21 years including the mattress.
Not even his own manifesto
Carolyne Sunday, July 24th at 5:18PM EST (link)It looks like the so-called manifesto was originally penned by Ted Kaczynski, the Unabomber. This Norwegian slime-ball couldn’t even come up with an original thought. Free Republic has the translation of the article from Verdens Gang…..
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2753209/posts
Sorry, I disagree
steve53 Monday, July 25th at 8:46AM EST (link)Why is Christian terrorism largely nonexistent (today) except among a few crazies? Because Jesus (unlike Muhammad) was non-violent; he did not teach nor exemplify violence. It is as simple as that. There was Christian violence in the past but in no way does it accord with the example and the teachings of Jesus. If Mr. Erickson truly believed Christians are “not of this world,” then there would be no need for Christian activism. There would be no need for Christian involvement in the tea party and other political movements. This “we are not of this world” is flat out dangerous dogma! It is in fact (mis)used by too many Christians as an excuse to neglect an important obligation we have toward society and culture.
The truth is after all subjective
mutantone Monday, July 25th at 12:05PM EST (link)He might have been a christian but the reason he did what he did was related to his Darwinist view, or so he said
Rightist ideology
severed2009 Monday, July 25th at 6:13PM EST (link)The book associated with this Norwegian begins by saying that all ideology is false; the rest is ideology. Straw men, simplified either-or thinking, paranoia, selected facts, no sense of humor or irony . . . The guys in this book think like Stalinists, extreme born-again Christians, extremist Muslims.
They are against homosexuality, for different roles for men and women, for the nation, for freedom (but not freedom for political correctness or multiculturalism), for the traditional values and morality of their religion. All these they have in common with the Muslims they fear (except the nation stuff), and not in common with the European mainstream they want to get rid of.
Traditional European Christianity defended monarchy and fought to preserve the traditional class structure of Europe. Also, such an animal did not exist — there were Catholic Christians and non-Catholic Christians, and they fought each other for generations. This traditional Christianity still exists in Northern Ireland.
When Europeans took nations seriously, the nations fought. The English, French, Germans, Russians etc. marched to the slaughter in 1914 and again just over two decades later. England and France battled for centuries.
Our Norwegian killed a whole bunch of people because he could see no way of getting others to share his yearning for the good old days. He did not recognize that he was just as brainwashed as the multiculturalists; we get unbrainwashed by listening carefully to each other; you do my brain, I do yours, slowly and carefully.
The reality is that God is waiting for us to stop fighting and killing over which definitions of Him are valid. He is probably going to let us pollute ourselves to death and move on to a planet with better prospects. He probably incarnates Himself and “dies” on each planet; if He only did it once, why here?
Why are you on here?
runner12 (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 6:36PM EST (link)You are spewing out garbage and false garbage at that.
First of all, quote to me in the Bible where this guys actions line up with Biblical Christianity. They don’t. Jesus said to love your enemies and pray for those who curse you, that is about as anti-violence as you can get. I might also add that murder is a SIN according to Christianity.
Secondly, Christians do not hate people who are gay. They disagree with their lifestyle and believe it to be a sin, but that does not mean they hate them. Do not confuse the two. I disagree with many people on different things, but that does not mean I hate them. This is not an extreme Christian position, it is a mainstream one.
Third, it has since been disproven that this monster of a person was a Christian and a conservative. He pulled his manifesto from the Unabomber, hardly a conservative or a Christian. The murderer in Norway was much closer to anarchy and has not been affiliated with any party.
Finally I would add that your post says more about your own hate of religion, most of all Christianity. Your only complaint against us is that they do not agree with you. You fail to mention all of the charities, orphanages, and missionaries who aid people around the world. Nor do you mention that Christians ars the most charitable group in the USA. But because we disagree with you, we are all evil.
P.S. You also need to brush up on your European history my friend, Christians did not always support traditionalist monarchies or policies. In fact, it was those hateful evangelical Christians who successfully pushed to abolish the slave trade in Great Britain and who also stopped the discrimination against Catholics.
why not
severed2009 Tuesday, July 26th at 5:05AM EST (link)I like to see what people I disagree with are up to. Some times I learn things from them to improve my thinking, and some times I learn things about human nature.
Plenty of Christians have justified some pretty brutal stuff from the Bible. They found the quotes somewhere.
Christians do not like to think straight about gay people. It is only a sin if you can help it. If God punishes people for the way He made them, then He must hate them, since he has cursed them. And if He can do it then so can we.
The evangelicals were not traditional Christians. Anglicans and Catholics were.
I dont hate religion, although I do have the usual Protestant thing about Catholics. A friend explained to me how an infallible gathering of Bishops or something infallibly decided that henceforth the Pope would be infallible. I found it utterly weird that this made sense to him. I do hate hypocrisy about pederasty, but then who doesnt?
Since you guys are a minority, you should be happy when somebody not in your minority appears here, so you can practice conversion spiels on them while they practice their conversion spiels on you. But you are not. So you must have some other plan for dealing with us, like pushing us so far from power you dont have to talk to us. Which is unAmerican.
I realy think that you....
gekster (Diary) Tuesday, July 26th at 6:42AM EST (link)should quit getting high, and seek some psychiatric help.
And who are the “you guys” that are a minority.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
He dies on each planet?
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 7:38PM EST (link)Oh boy, you have just exceeded every tin foil nutcase that has ever been banned on this site in stupidity.
And you have no clue as to how “extreme” born again Christians think and that is quite obvious.
First prize winner? No Kidding?
severed2009 Tuesday, July 26th at 5:13AM EST (link)Extreme born again Christians think like Topeka’s Wildman. Which means not that they agree with him but that their thought processes and ways of reasoning are similar.
You mean that this is the only planet in the universe with intelligent life, or that He dies on each one, or that it is up to homo sapiens to make sure the gospel gets to the rest of the universe? Which one does the Bible say it is? Do we have to start titheing to send out missionary space probes in all directions? Or will God send out the gospels with a translation key? Or maybe they dont have souls on other planets?
You have surpassed
powertothepeople (Diary) Tuesday, July 26th at 11:16AM EST (link)tin foil stupidity and entered the land of absolute nutcase.
Now maybe you are on of the ” I was probed by green men with big eyes when I left my trailer to get another six pack” type of guys, but this is a serious site devoted to fighting democrats and your nonsense is not worth devoting another second to.
HLSD Napolitano Said So
Jeff Cooper (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 6:42PM EST (link)Janet said that terrorist are white; I saw the video that showed me so. And miraculously, and very unfortunately for the victims, a white, christian terrorist appears, as if on queue. I am not suggesting anything sketchy here, but the timing is interesting.
I am not a conspiracy theorist but when I heard the reports from our news that the perp was a right-wing extremist, a red flag went up. Something doesn’t seem right with all of this, and I feel there is something larger looming behind a curtain. I am just saying.
Can you be a Christian if you don't believe in God and have no connectio to Christ?
cordpt Monday, July 25th at 6:56PM EST (link)Because that was his case. From his compedium:
If you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God then you are a religious Christian. Myself and many more like me do not necessarily have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God.
Other than that, he’d be a conservative in the sense the word was used in Continental Europe a couple of centuries ago – basically a reactionary. He’s anti-capitalist, anti-free speech and in favour of conceding a vast degree of authority and control to the state and the central government.
To associate him with current day anglo-saxon conservatives is just crazy.
No. -nt-
Bill S (Diary) Monday, July 25th at 7:09PM EST (link).
“It’s such a fine line between stupid, and clever.” – David St. Hubbins
Thanks for the hat tip
chipbennett (Diary) Wednesday, August 10th at 12:58AM EST (link)I expounded on it a bit.
God bless you, Erick!
Derek V. Baker (Diary) Tuesday, July 26th at 1:11PM EST (link)Perfectly stated, Erick, both regarding the Oslo killer and what the Bible teaches about such acts and what is expected of His children.
religions
jolinarofmalkshur Wednesday, July 27th at 8:45PM EST (link)Like Taliban and Osama bin laden, these are not religious people; they sully the religions to which they belong. Jihad was in islam against the pagans(to convert the multigod pagans to their religion) exactly how in Talmud was written that only Jews are people, the non-Jews are cattle with human faces and they deserve to be treated as such. And they applied this 3000??years ago to force the multigod pagans to adopt their mosaic religion. It does not apply today. Charlemagne treated the same way the Anglo Saxons who did not want to convert to Christianity. The Anglo-Saxons fled away to Norse people (aka vikings) and told the vikings what happened and this prompted the vikings’ invasions in Europe. I hope I got my history right. Marx brought back the ancient tactic of the Jews, of treating people as cattle with human faces in communism: abolishing the private property reduced people to cattle; cattle is/are not allowed to have property. This time were not the Jews from antiquity who did this but the proletariat was framed and the red terrorist enforcers were the ones who enforced Marx’ policies. I hope they will burn in hell, together with Marx…Oh! No! Wait! They are the rulers of hell. What pity that I cannot even curse them! Damn!!!!
Jolinar
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