An outside effort by conservative activists around the country is gaining steam. The effort, to get Mike Pence to run for President, is intriguing many old guard conservatives in Washington and activists around the country. The effort is being organized by a group calling itself the “America’s President Committee”. Former Congressman Jim Ryun of Kansas is lending his voice to the cause.
With tea party sentiment running high and a preference for a new face instead of someone who lost the primary fight in 2008, Pence makes an intriguing choice for many.
This morning a new website called www.theconservativechampion.org goes live as a way to get conservatives signed up and on the Pence bandwagon immediately.
Congressman Pence is still weighing whether to run for President or Governor of Indiana. The path of least resistance seems to be Governor, but then many paths without resistance are simply lures away from the race intended. The Congressman is expected to decide later this month what he’ll do.
Victoria Coates
Daniel Horowitz
Pence/Palin
smitch61 Monday, January 17th at 6:28AM EST (link)Palin/Pence Pence and anybody, Palin and anybody. These two are the only true conservatives out there (excluding DeMint) that I am encouraged enough to engage in. I hope he considers it. I hope she considers it, I hope for change.
Palin is toxic.
writeblock Monday, January 17th at 2:29PM EST (link)And Pence is a good conservative–but so what? Where’s his resume?
I fail to understand the attraction. He strikes me as totally lacking in charisma or distinction of any kind. He’s this cycle’s Duncan Hunter. I’m waiting to be convinced. But please don’t tell me what he believes–tell me what he’s DONE to deserve the presidency. If no one can answer that–then his candidacy is another exercise is how to lose elections.
Yeah, I know.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 2:33PM EST (link)Rudy is the ONLY one who can win.
And because of that, you dismiss everyone else.
So what else is new.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
Please Run Pence
msbs05 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:17AM EST (link)Several months ago I set up the twitter name PencePatriot after hearing Pence speak at the FRC convention in DC. I have never believed in any politician before like I do Pence. He is a real conservative that does not play games,& is always civil even while being firm in his beliefs, He gives the best speaches I’ve ever heard and backs them up with conservative votes. Anyone who isnt sure Pence should be our president, needs to read more about him. I would love a Pence/Cantor ticket. I could not think of any better team. Pence does not have the baggage of the other Republicans running. Romney is moderate and did healthcare in MA. Huckabee is too nice and to much of a compromiser, Newt has tons of baggage from the 90′s. Christie and Palin wont run. American needs someone with experience that isnt the typical politician and I pray daily Mike Pence will run. I’ll work every day to help him in TN if he will just say yes!!! American needs Pence.
I don't get it.
writeblock Monday, January 17th at 2:36PM EST (link)I’ve checked his speeches out. Good content. Poor delivery. Pence always looks terrified–or miserable–or both. I mean this sincerely. I’m not trying to dis his chances. But this is the presidency we’re talking about. We’ve already got a novice in the Oval Office. It’s time for somebody with a ton of executive experience. This thread is starting to give me the creeps. All I see coming if this plays out is another four years for Obama.
I normally don't agree with drafting efforts
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:06AM EST (link)to convince candidates to run for office, but, Pence himself has previously expressed an interest in running for the Presidency. I pray every day that he decide on a Presidential run. 2012 is critical in getting rid of Obama, and, Mike Pence is the one to accomplish that. He has no baggage, he has never allowed Washington to change his conservative principals, even when some of his votes were against party, and he has leadership abilities like no other.
Go Mike Pence. That’s for you Aaron!
Where's the "leadership ability"?
writeblock Monday, January 17th at 8:39PM EST (link)What has he ever led?
Pence for President!
vtdelacy Monday, January 17th at 8:08AM EST (link)Mike Pence has a decade long record in the Congress as a principled pro-life conservative who may be fully trusted with leading America back into a preserving rightward direction. His record of dependable service is longer than that of Sarah Palin and after dealing with the Congress for a decade I have no doubt that he will be able to effectively deal with the conflicts and responsibilities that arise in the presidency. He won the straw poll at the Values Voters’ Summit most recently and if you listen to his speech online you will understand why that was the case – he IS the principled conservative our nation needs at the helm of the nation in these troubling times, which is why I do not hesitate to suggest him enthusiastically for the presidency next year!
"Traditionally speaking"
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:41AM EST (link)Okay, so we are conservatives. Conservatives respect and appreciate traditional values. We tend to take a very traditional approach to situations.
Plenty of people could look at this situation and say to themselves “traditionally speaking, people who have executive experience have a better chance of being elected into office”, etc. And to a certain extent, I agree with this statement because it is a valid statement.
But every so often, a situation arises in our lives where we could actually accomplish and achieve more in the long run to break away from our traditional approach than stick to it. And I’m becoming convinced with each day that passes this is one of those moments.
Mr. Pence knows the kind of environment that exists in Washington, D.C. He knows the kinds of games that can be and are played for the sake of “politics”. He’s taken a strong stand for conservative principles time after time. He’s proven that he will stand by those principles, come what may come.
I can and do support his running for President. Please, consider it, Mr. Pence. We need someone with your strengths, sir.
I beg to differ.
writeblock Monday, January 17th at 2:42PM EST (link)We need someone who can win a general election. Winning a district in Indiana proves nothing politically. Let’s get real here. The stakes are too high to be playing Russian roulette with the GOP nomination–hoping that maybe, just maybe, a guy like Pence might rise to the occasion and squeak out a win. He’s a congressman with a slight resume. That’s not going to impress somebody from my neck of the woods–PA–or any other battleground state.
Pence is Presidential
etheilen Monday, January 17th at 8:58AM EST (link)in every way. We definitely need to oust the tired, old blood that has been rooting around the Presidential camping grounds (Huckabee, Newt, Romney) for too long. Pence brings with him an enervation of bright, intelligent, thoughtful energy which is what we need right now. The two men that I have long admired for possible Presidential runs are Mike Pence and Steve King of Iowa but it looks as though Pence has already acquired quite a bit of headwind to make it happen. Pence for President!
"If you can run, run."
Sam Gamgee Monday, January 17th at 9:04AM EST (link)I just went back and listened to Mike Pence’s 2010 CPAC speech. It’s great, and I encourage everyone to listen to it. Towards the end, he has a great quote:
“This is our moment. Now is the time. It’s time for all of us to do all that we can to preserve what makes this country great. If you can give, give. If you can speak, speak. If you can write, write. And if you can run, run.”
So Congressman Pence, now is the time for you do do what you can to make this country great. You can run, so run!
“I wonder what sort of tale we’ve fallen into.”
Here ya go. Mike pence 2010 CPAC speech.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:10AM EST (link)They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
gekster i love it but
dbill27 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:05AM EST (link)where was this video taken? oh cpac 2010, didnt they have a presidential straw poll there? Who won that in a landslide again? oh yeah
STOP
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:08AM EST (link)This is a thread about Pence. Keep your LuapNor stuff in its own threads.
Threadjacking is forbidden.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
hows this
dbill27 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:16AM EST (link)i love mike pence, ive actually met him in person hes from my home town hes a great guy, if ron paul doesnt run he would be the only other republican i would vote for
That's fine.
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:35AM EST (link)Just keep it about Pence in a Pence thread.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
So far I hear...
writeblock Tuesday, January 18th at 8:56AM EST (link)1. He’s a nice guy.
2. He’s a conservative.
3. He looks presidential.
I don’t hear
1. That’s he can win elections outside his district.
2. That he’s ever done anything significant besides run for Congress.
3. That he’s in any way, shape or form charismatic.
Do social conservatives have a death wish? Do they want to stop abortions by achieving political power or do they just want to feel good for the short haul by backing a man without a prayer of winning in the general election? Obama is now at 54% approval in a WP poll. That should sober you up sufficiently to realize the next presidential election is not going to be a cake walk. We don’t need the like of Pence at the top of our ticket–not if we want to win.
Palin said
sharonmcp (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:49AM EST (link)After the events of last week, I personally don’t see how Sarah Palin could possibly win the nomination.
However, she has said that if a strong conservative candidate joined the race that she would do all she could to help them get elected.
I believe Mike Pence is that strong conservative candidate.
“Above all, we must realize that no arsenal, or no weapon in the arsenals of the world, is so formidable as the will and moral courage of free men and women.” ~ Ronald Reagan
I think she has always said that if someone with the right values would step up
carolina Monday, January 17th at 10:21AM EST (link)she would support them. She would run herself IF no one with the right vlaues stepped up. I think that she would support Pence (or DeMint).
Yes, I can see that Pence is likely the best candidate the repubs could run. (anyone but Romney, please)
I think she has always said that if someone with the right values would step up
carolina Monday, January 17th at 10:21AM EST (link)she would support them. She would run herself IF no one with the right vlaues stepped up. I think that she would support Pence (or DeMint).
Yes, I can see that Pence is likely the best candidate the repubs could run. (anyone but Romney, please)
Thanks for letting the MSM "kill" our candidates
hrh40 Monday, January 17th at 2:45PM EST (link)before the race has even gotten underway.
That’s the fighting spirit!
Glad you love our country so much that you’ll let vile operators dictate to us who can and can’t run.
I guess it’s no longer We the People who elect our officials.
Now it’s We the Progressive Media who elects them for us.
Sad, really.
http://hrh40.wordpress.com
Unfortunately, she's contributing to the meme
Paula (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:30PM EST (link)To what end, I don’t know, but Palin is not helping herself by showing up on Dancing with the Stars and TLC. Those are nice gigs for a media star, but for a president? Many of us on the right have been (rightfully) critical of Obama for being a media hound. It’s not any more appealing from Sarah Palin, IMO.
While I think she has some very valid points about the MSM/LSM (whatever) and has a remarkable ability to push the left’s buttons and make them look ridiculous, I can’t see how that will play well in a GOP primary. What will her talking points be in a debate between herself, Pence, Romney, et. al?
Paula
My blog: Bold Colors
Follow me on Twitter: pbolyard
paulkib- This person
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:46PM EST (link)has been here shilling for Palin in every way possible. I don’t know if you’ve been reading long enough to have seen his/her rhetoric.
Debates are one of Palin's strong points.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:55PM EST (link)It’s one of the reasons she won in Alaska. She also creamed Biden.
I agree
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:17PM EST (link)The reality show and DWTS did not help her politically. She made a gamble and lost.
Yes the media was unfair.
But she did not help herself by doing things that made her look unprofessional.
hrh40- It's not just the MSM
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:54PM EST (link)that is not in love with your gal Palin. On Sunday morning, Bill Kristol, who has been a long time fan of Palin’s even admitted that she hurt herself when she put out her 8 minute video, after the right had already come out and defended her and proved the MSM to be idiots over the Arizona tragedy. She put out her message of sadness and sorrow for the victims of the shooting shortly after the event, and that is where she should have stopped. Waiting until Wednesday made her look like she was playing the victim. As Kristol, and I believe Brit Hume said, she would have done herself much better to just let the right talking heads defend her. If she wants the MSM to shut up, then stop giving them talking points.
She doesn't want the MSM to shut up.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:57PM EST (link)The more they attack her, the more irrelevant they become. But I guess because you’re in love with “your guy” Pence, you’ve started to side with the MSM.
For the record.... at Big Govt - Americans trust Palin more after video
carolina Monday, January 17th at 8:29PM EST (link)They have a link to a newsbusters article – snip:
Destroying this myth was a new poll published by Media Curves that actually found Americans seeing the former Alaska governor as more likeable, sincere, and believable after watching her speech
Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/01/15/media-myth-busted-americans-view-palin-more-sincere-and-believable-af#ixzz1BLWXaIc8
Pence and Ryan
melissatx (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:22AM EST (link)Pence and Pawlenty
Pence and Christie…or
Pence and Allen
All good choices.
But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever. John Adams
Your'e not real interested in executive experience
hrh40 Monday, January 17th at 2:46PM EST (link)for an executive position.
Curious.
http://hrh40.wordpress.com
hrh40- Obviously that was just a comment stuck wherever you felt like sticking it
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:06PM EST (link)There was absolutely nothing in the comment you replied to that had anything to do with executive experience. In fact, Pence is still a sitting rep., elected again to his 5th term, Pawlenty finished his terms as Governor, Christie is still in his term as Governor, and I assume the poster meant George Allen, he also completed his term as Governor of VA. Your gal Palin quit half way through her first term as Governor.
Executive experience????
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:23PM EST (link)Sarah Palin was elected mayor by a vote of 640 to 420. That is about the size of the election of student body president at a small high school.
She was the executive of dozens of employees (60-70 employees) In comparison, an average Wal Mart manager has HUNDREDS of employees.
The White House staff, for example is THOUSANDS of employees. The Wasilla staff was closer to the size of the staff of the First Lady.
Yes, she was governor of a state. But she quit after two years.
So I’m not seeing the “executive experience” that you keep talking about.
There is a website for Pence for President website
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:25AM EST (link)already reserved. I know that if candidates have the first notion of possibly running for anything, they reserve a website just in case. I hope this site becomes active very soon.
http://repmikepenceforpresident.com
The link just says that the site is unavailable at this time.
I like him but...well executive experience matters
Bean (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:51AM EST (link)I like Pence-everything I’ve heard about him is positive, but I think to be ready to be president you need real executive experience of a large organization. Look at our past presidents and find a good one with no real executive experience. The only one that comes to my mind is Lincoln, and he is the exception that proves the rule.
There is a reason conservatives like tradition-
because tradition is another word for learning from the past, and we’ve learned that going straight from legislator to president doesn’t usually work out well.
Pence, Christie, Rubio, Haley and Jindal (and others) are all a great farm team, for presidential candidate in 2016 and beyond but they all need more experience as leaders..
For 2012 we need someone with a solid record and experience to contrast with Obama-someone like Gov. Mitch Daniels. A two term Governor who broke the public sector union on his first day in office, who has balanced the budget and capped property taxes.
I like Pence-but for 2016 or 2020 (hopefully ’20…).
YIKES to tradition
Freedoms Truth (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 2:33PM EST (link)“There is a reason conservatives like tradition-…”
The Republican tradition is to recycle our previous losers….
McCain (loser in 2000 primary)
Dole (loser in 1988 primary)
GHWBush ( loser in 1980 primary, then VP)
Reagan (lost in 1976 primary)
Nixon (lost in 1960)
It’s a bad tradition. The Democrats dont recycle the losers as much.
Our recycled losers for 2012 would be Romney or Huckabee.
I think we need to do better.
I disagree that Jindhal is a farm team – he’s ready to lead NOW, but is not running.
PENCE FOR PRESIDENT.
Freedoms Truth,
Travis Monitor – http://travismonitor.blogspot.com
Austin, TX
Yes, this is one of those traditions
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:33PM EST (link)we would be well-advised to break away from repeating.
Regarding what you have said about Jindal, I’d love to see his legal background in WH legally cutting the bonds of every unnecessary bureaucratic department operating in our government.
But as you said, he isn’t running, soooo…….
Bean- I'm going to borrow a comment I saw someone else post
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:16PM EST (link)Your guy Daniels has already “screwed the pooch.” His truce comment was bad enough, but then he doubled down on it. He said we all need to be adults and understand that we might have to raise taxes. He would support a VAT. He would cut the defense budget even more than the O’s admin has, and that’s going some.
For the fiscal hawk that he supposedly is, he told Neil Cavuto last Thursday that to spend so much time on talking about earmarks is a waste of time, and a distraction. He doesn’t think they are all that important. True, if all earmarks are cut, it wouldn’t turn the economy around, but, to dismiss a few million here and a few million there is irresponsible. The earmark discussion is important to conservatives, if not because of the cost, but because they are used to buy votes, and to collect donations back in your district or state to insure your re-election.
I personally don’t think he is going to run. If he was serious, he would be more careful than to repeatedly say things that anger those whose votes he would need in order to win.
And Scope, cutting earmarks says
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:40PM EST (link)that they are at least willing to try to provide leadership and to be trustworthy in how they use public funds.
It’s a start, which is better than nothing, which is exactly what we have every time someone makes inane statements indicating that earmarks don’t matter.
True but his point was
Bean (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:06PM EST (link)The focus on them obscures the larger issue.
As if they aren't capable of doing both?
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:58PM EST (link)There is absolutely nothing in this world that says that they can’t focus on larger issues AND reduce/eliminate earmarks at the same time.
As to the earmarks....
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:46PM EST (link)Isn’t that just money to buy votes.
If they are gone, maybe the Congresspeople will vote thier constituants desires, not the one paying them.
I don’t think thats a small mater.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
You said experience from a large corporation, right?
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:37PM EST (link)Then put Cain and Pence on the same ticket.
What large corporation was Pence in charge of?
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:48PM EST (link)I like Pence alot, but calling a think tank a large corporation is a stretch—both of the word “large” and the word “corporation”.
Does anyone refer to William F. Buckley as a former CEO? He was, but refering to National Review as a corporation is a bit misleading.
Pence’s think tank and WFB’s magazine are both in the politics business. They don’t exactly involve the same kinds of business issues as most businesses.
The Druge Report is a corporation, but I wouldn’t say that Matt Drudge has executive corporate experience.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Cain was, not Pence. [nt]
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:50PM EST (link)Jsob- Here's another thought
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:38PM EST (link)I am assuming that you believe being a governor is qualified executive experience, right? One of the thoughts I’ve had is the fact that Governor’s haven’t had to rely on making profits in order to make payroll, or even to pay the state’s bills. In fact they have staff that do all those functions, and have taxpayer money and federal government money to cover those expenses. Sure, they have budgets they should stick to, but, it’s very different than having to go out and get clients in order to pay your office manager all the tuna she/he needs. LOL Do you see my point? Here in VA out Lt. Governor is responsible for going out and attracting businesses to the state, in order to raise the tax revenues and provide jobs. The Governor doesn’t have that responsibility, other than overseeing his agenda. In order to see what it is like to run a business, and to me it can be making a payroll of 25 employees or 25,000 employees, and paying the accounts payable for the business so that your vendors keep you supplied with material is real executive experience. I actually think that someone who runs a smaller company or organization is much more hands on, and knows that profits mean breaking or making that business. The small business/organization owner or boss is the one staying awake at night with all the responsibility. Herman Cain is honestly the only candidate that I know of so far that has had that type of experience. I won’t even address Romney, because he has so many other faults. Trump I won’t include because I don’t think he has any chance. Who else is there with experience running a business? I like Herman Cain very much as a person, and as a good conservative, but he has the problem of not being able to win a Senate election, I understand in a Republican year. Some are saying they want Pence to run for Governor first, to gain “executive experience” before going for the Presidency. Should the same apply to Cain, in asking him to run for a lower office first before going for the top prize.
Being governor is the best experience because it is most analogous to being President
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:05PM EST (link)Presiding over a bureaucracy that “works for you” while often acting contrary to your instructions
Dealing with a legislature, a carrot and stick exercise that has no equivalent in the private sector.
I agree with you that the small business owner feels the economy in a way others don’t, but I am not interested in selecting a President on that basis.
A CEO of a typical business enterprise is not nearly as adversarial as being a governor or president. The board of directors selects the CEO. The President and Congress are often off different parties.
I would vote for Pence over Cain because I don’t see Cain’s business experience as being particularly analogous executive experience.
Pence lacks executive experience, but if I were to deviate from a governor’s only rule, it would be for Pence. He does seem like a great conservative unifier, but the lack of executive experience is a negative against him.
Cutting spending is not simply a matter of will. It is a matter of political skill, knowing how to negotiate with a legislature. There is simply no private sector equivalent.
I am probably leaning Barbour at the moment, but its very fluid. Will definitely be paying attention to the race when it starts in earnest.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
JS, the biggest problem I have with
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:32PM EST (link)some of the traditional candidates being considered is this mindset of “the government’s money”. This kind of mindset is so prevalent in Washington, D.C. that I’m not even sure even some of the candidates we consider as being conservative are consciously aware that they do thing and say things that reflect all too plainly that they have developed this kind of mentality.
It is NOT the government’s money…it is PUBLIC funds that are intended to be spent on we the people, not on dog-and-pony sideshow tricks like studies in Africa of how men wash their genitals. Neither is it intended to be spent in making “Let’s Make A Deal” with lobbyists of any kind.
As long as this mindset goes on being the status quo in Washington, D.C., how do we ever expect to see anything that remotely resembles a balanced budget? If we can’t get a balanced budget, how do we ever hope to see solid growth and development in our economy?
Cain comes from outside that scope of mentality and brings a totally new perspective to the situation. He’s not entrenched in it to the hilt the way so many potential-candidates are.
A second problem I have is this mindset of just riding the middle of the road “for the sake of peace” all the time. We shouldn’t have to ride the middle of road when it comes to the Constitution, or to individual freedoms and liberty, or to maintaining and supporting the law. Those are cases when it should be standing up for principle because it is RIGHT.
Pence has taken that stand on principles more times than most. He’s proven that he’s dependable, reliable, and trustworthy on these things.
For these reasons, I’m willing to be open-minded in considering that both of these gentleman could be the kind of leader that this nation genuinely needs right now.
But on this point we do agree…at this point, so much is conjecture as to who will run and who will not run. Time will tell on this point and I’m looking forward to hearing from all of the candidates.
I am not advocating for a "middle of the road" candidate
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:41PM EST (link)I am simply pointing out the following:
(1) Being governor is the closest job their is to be President (short of being President or Prime Minister of a different country)
(2) If cutting spending were easy, it would have been done already.
My father stands on principles more than most. He is proven dependable, reliable, and trustworthy. Doesn’t mean he has the experience to hit the ground running as President of the US.
Legislators just vote on stuff. Ideology is 99% of a legislator. Being an executive is different.
Presidents are more than a collection of policy positions. There is a skill to being a good executive that falls outside mere ideological terms. We currently have a President with a bad ideology and no prior executive experience. I want a President with a conservative ideology AND executive experience that proves it, and proves that the person actually knows how to use executive power.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
I guess it all depend on how we see the priorities. [nt]
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:52PM EST (link)Jsob- By necessity Governors must
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:37PM EST (link)more often than not play the middle of the road, on at least some issues, and sometimes on very important legislation. Gov. Christie said yesterday, sitting with Chris Wallace that he has to give some, in order to get at least some of what he wants. When a Republican Governor doesn’t have majorities in both state Houses, as here in VA, the dealing starts. In VA, the Democrats still control the state Senate. Gov. McDonnell has proposed some of his ideas, such as privatizing our current state owned and run liquor stores. The Democrats are fighting him because they don’t want to give up the revenues collected by the state. He reopened our rest stops, that the former Democrat Governor closed in order to close the huge budget deficit. He wants to privatize the rest stop maintenance. He has proposed a cut in State Government employees pay, and has proposed that they contribute to their pension and benefit plans. Don’t know if that has been accomplished, but, you know the Democrats are screaming. Again, Governors must, by necessity, compromise, or agree on bi-partisan legislation to get anything they want. Do you think that Obama, as president, has given an inch to our side, or acted in any bi-partisan manner for the last two years?
I am more in line with lineholder, and could not agree more that I now want someone who has character, integrity, leadership qualities, and an unequivocal record of staying with conservative principles, despite being in DC for 10 years. Pence, despite being the 3rd ranking House member in Congress, has never wandered from his principles. You are correct that a president isn’t all about policy positions, there are many other requirements to be successful in that role. Appealing to a wide swath of voters is one, and Pence is not offensive to the many. That is very important. Pence can articulate his ideas and positions in a way that appeals to the electorate, he is not elitist, and he doesn’t speak down to anyone. One of the things that I like is that those that know Pence say he is the real deal, and what you see is what you get. Pence knows the antics that go on in Washington, and knows what to expect from the House and Senate with all their shennanigans. He has 10 years worth of experience in dealing with a fractious Congressional body, both when the Republicans had power, and now with the Dem. majorities. That is important to me. You certainly can put your litmus test on who you would/could support for the presidency, and others certainly will do the same. One thing I believe I do know is that you will support him, if he runs, and, gets the nod. No one can expect more than that.
Scope, you have proven my point
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:18PM EST (link)Presidents, no different than governors–both are forced to deal with the other side while still pushing their own agenda. How effective a person is in that regard will say alot about how successful the administration will be.
With a governor, we see if the person is still able to push a conservative agenda or not while dealing with the opposition. I would like to see how a candidate reacts to that situation before making them President. Pence as legislator is inevitably going to be different in some ways then Pence as chief executive, and it would be nice to see how that plays out before making Pence President.
A legislator can just vote the right way and wash their hands of most things. How a governor deals with the legislature is not only informative, but its good practice for dealing with Congress.
I like Pence, but he has never had the accountability of being a governor. I would prefer voting for a governor, but I won’t vote for Romney or Huckabee in the Republican primary.
We learn a lot more in advance about candidates when they are governors. While 2012 may be an exception (as was 2008), I think that from 2016 onwards all of the serious presidential candidates will be governors.
McDonnell would potentially make a great candidate as well.
Reagan dealt with the opposing legislators in a far more effective way than W did. Much of that was evident in their backgrounds, as there aren’t too many libs in Texas.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
JSob, where do the higher priorities lie for you?
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:48PM EST (link)And I’m just asking a question for the sake of learning something, that’s all.
The ideal would be to put someone in office who has both executive experience and the kind of character that stands firmly by conservative principles.
But if the ideal doesn’t present itself, then where do the priorities lie? Is the higher priority on executive experience or on personal character?
I just think we’re coming at this from different viewpoints right now. I would probably go with character at this point, and I think Scope would as well.
And I made this point below…we’ve got a headwind of growing public sentiment behind us right now and we may not necessarily have that in 2016.
Should we put leaders or executives in the WH? And I know that they aren’t mutually exclusive. But which would be best for our nation?
There is only priority (effective conservative governance), and that requires all three
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:16PM EST (link)character, conservative values, and executive leadership capabilities.
If you want conservative change, you need all three. With every candidate, there will be a weakest factor. That being said, if you were hiring a heart surgeon, would you want someone who had performed the procedure before?
You could have the most conservative person with character in the office, but if they don’t have the chops they won’t be effective. Similarly, who wants effectiveness without principle (Nixon).
Its all sliding scale stuff. Some executives are proven leaders.
All I know is there a comment upstream about how some speech makes Pence the right man for the job. I don’t think good speeches are the key requirements for a good presidency.
The Presidency can be overwhelming to someone not used to exerting executive power.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Okay, now I see where you are coming from.
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:40PM EST (link)Thanks for answering my question, JSob.
I believe that we both want to get the right candidate in there. And even if we don’t agree NOW on who that person might be, when it comes right down to it, we’ll be united in “AnybodybutObama”, right?
Yes, don't make the mistake that this is some kind of "resume" requirement
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:53PM EST (link)As Scope pointed out with respect to governors, a US President is going to be forced to make certain compromises. I really hope we get someone who has proven to be adept at cutting deals selectively and in ways that move the ball forward for conservatism.
In terms of your last question, absolutely. I would vote for Huckabee against Obama, and Huckabee is last on my list.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Pence Speeches
msbs05 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:55AM EST (link)JSob, you are probably refering to my comment about hearing Pence speak and then setting up my twitter account PencePatriot. If speeches were the only thing I looked for in a president then I might have voted for Obama (gag). His speech at SRLC in New Orleans is what first got me inspired to look into who this man is, because he moved me when he spoke. After that speech I saw his solid conservative voting record, and saw he went against party moderates when their principles clashed, but did so in a way that left no one angry. He showed respect for others and their opinions, without bending on his own beliefs. That is a hard thing to do and still have everyone respect you. DeMint never bends on principle and I love him, but he does get people upset with him, inside and outside the party. Pence has the same voting record but is admired by all groups in the party. Part of it is his ability to really listen to what others are saying, part is his natural humility, and part is his ability to articulate his own points in a reasoned, calm, nonthreatening way. Plus, Pence was the number 3 GOP guy and charged with putting the GOP back in charge in the house. Well, mission over-accomplished there.
All that being said, if you have someone on the stump that is a poor speaker, a boring speaker, that doesnt reach people, no amount of leadership experience or achievement will matter because no one will listen. Pence can speak so well, can move people inside and out of the party. He can remind you of his principles while being humble (Obama should take notes) and he can talk about the problems we have and the solutions without sounding like he is lecturing or ridiculing (again, Obama should take note). Lastly, Pence doesnt need a teleprompter for his speeches because he speaks from his heart and says what he believes, not what he thinks you want to hear. (again Obama should…) Pence is the real deal and everyone will tell you that, from left and right. I cannot think of anyone better to run in 2012, and I have put much thought into this. Give it some time and I think you will agree.
I must admit
aesthete (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 3:12PM EST (link)that Mike Huckabee is the only potential Republican candidate that I would definitely not vote for in the primary. That said, I strongly agree with the rest of your sentiments: executive experience is important because it allows us to see one’s rhetoric in action in a job that most closely resembles the Presidency in style and in the challenges that will be faced. The only potential substitute to such experience would be a military governorship in an area where locals have some autonomy (and where there is thus some of the give-and-take that is present in legislative bodies).
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
Scope, your logic is unfortunately very accurate
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:52PM EST (link)“By necessity governors must more than not play the middle of the road, on at least some issues, and sometimes on very important legisation”
Its harder for a governor to govern conservatively than it is for a legislator to vote conservatively. I like Pence, but he voted against things like TARP knowing that they would ultimately pass. Even had it not passed, Pence would not have been individually accountable for what happened next.
Legislators are judged by how they vote.
Executives are judged based on what happens.
Totally different ballgames. Which is why you want to avoid governors, because they are forced by events to make certain compromises. Of course, that is exactly what a President will be forced to do as well.
We want someone who is a proven negotiator when in comes to legislative bodies. That person may be less pure than a non-governor, but the non-governor will be unproven.
Obama has handled Congress in a dumb way. Imagine if he would have offered the R’s a bone from the very beginning. Say, co-opted R support in exchange for some payroll tax cuts that the Rs wanted.
The political tone of his first year would be totally different. Similar things can be said about healthcare. He could have done some small things to get a respectable number of Rs on board. Peeling off a few votes takes some effort, some creativity,etc.
Obama could have put the R’s in a box and burried them 6 feet under. His lack of executive leadership and experience is what will sink him in 2012 if he loses. He is the master of self-inflicted wounds, and the left does not have a monopoly on that.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Jsob- I would disagree with
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:10PM EST (link)the fact that Obama had to work to get some R’s to peel off. We’ve been dealing with Snowe, Collins, Graham, McCain and any other number of squishy R’s. The R’s that did not run for re-election were a shoe in for Obama such as Judd Greg. They sealed his deals in the lame duck. How many Democrats do you think exist that would be peeled off by a Republican president? or by the Republican majority in the House? I’ll bet big bucks on none. That is a very big reason on why I put more store in a proven Republican currently in the House. He never wavered on his conservative principles, ever, no matter what the pressure. I want someone with that track record in the WH. I also don’t see Pence as executive experience dumb. He is 51 years old, and has been in the House for 10 years. That means he had 40 years in the private sector to learn the business ropes. He didn’t sit on his laurels for 40 years.
The fact that Obama peeled as few votes off as he did
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:24PM EST (link)on stimulus and Obamacare shows how inexperienced he was, and he has been paying a price ever since. It would have been easy to capture some Republican cover, but Obama lacked the experience in doing so.
Executives are forced to compromise. Reagan compromised. Lincoln compromised. Pence, unlike a governor, has never faced to pressure to compromise that governors and Presidents face every day.
Pence has no executive experience. He isn’t dumb, but we don’t know how he would deal with the responsibility of governing either. As you point out, governors are forced to make some middle of the road compromises, so they are closer to being known quantities.
What types of compromises would Pence make? We don’t know. We just know that he would have to make them.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
I don't think it was lack of experience
kyle8 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:15PM EST (link)I think they made a conscious decision not to court Republican votes.
Heaven knows that there were some Republicans who were falling all over themselves to try and make some deals.
They really wanted to do it all by themselves and take all the credit. They actually believed these measures would be popular.
That is why they hate us, and talk Radio and Fox so much. They think that we poisoned the well. Otherwise the idiot voters would be lapping up anything they told them.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
I don't think it was lack of experience
kyle8 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:15PM EST (link)I think they made a conscious decision not to court Republican votes.
Heaven knows that there were some Republicans who were falling all over themselves to try and make some deals.
They really wanted to do it all by themselves and take all the credit. They actually believed these measures would be popular.
That is why they hate us, and talk Radio and Fox so much. They think that we poisoned the well. Otherwise the idiot voters would be lapping up anything they told them.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
The fact that Obama peeled as few votes off as he did
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:24PM EST (link)on stimulus and Obamacare shows how inexperienced he was, and he has been paying a price ever since. It would have been easy to capture some Republican cover, but Obama lacked the experience in doing so.
Executives are forced to compromise. Reagan compromised. Lincoln compromised. Pence, unlike a governor, has never faced to pressure to compromise that governors and Presidents face every day.
Pence has no executive experience. He isn’t dumb, but we don’t know how he would deal with the responsibility of governing either. As you point out, governors are forced to make some middle of the road compromises, so they are closer to being known quantities.
What types of compromises would Pence make? We don’t know. We just know that he would have to make them.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
More importantly
aesthete (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 3:31PM EST (link)Obama only did as well as he did because of an incredible advantage in the legislature (what was it, 67ish seats in the Senate?), and a fawning media/pop culture infrastructure defending his every move. Had it been an experienced executive (Hillary Clinton does not apply) with those numbers and Obama’s favorable/unfavorable ratings at the beginning of his term, progressives would have gotten a New New Deal. A conservative President in 2012 will have none of that: he’ll have a legislature that will, at best, be a little better than evenly split, and an incredibly hostile media. Merely blabbing the standard conservative truisms about cutting government and reducing its scope (much less doing anything about it) already makes the MSM go into frothing fits that make Linda Blair in The Exorcist look reasonable by comparison.
There were a couple of individuals here criticizing Daniels for not advancing Right-To-Work a while back, and you know what? Regardless of the validity/practicality of their arguments, they were right to put the blame on Daniels: he’s the “decider”, as a well-known Republican put it, and the buck stops with him.
Governing is hard work, and we need someone who is good behind the scenes and who can assemble a quality team. That may entail sacrificing on the aesthetics of a candidate (maybe going for someone who’s a bit boring or *gasp* a Southerner who looks like Boss Hogg). In the end, 2012 will mostly be about whether inertia overwhelms distaste with Obama among voters (unless Palin is the frontrunner): IMO, we can sacrifice on charisma and candidate mythology, and we should put executive experience at a premium in the coming election. As most of you know, I’m a Daniels fan for Pres, but atm, Barbour also seems like a great choice. They both have in common experience cutting and reforming government to be smaller and better, and both still politically live to tell the tale. That’s a rare feat, and one that should be considered a near-prerequisite for our Presidents, IMO.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
Why not look for proven budget cutters?
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:42PM EST (link)nt
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Such as? [nt]
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:52PM EST (link)Jsob- Why not look for proven
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:56PM EST (link)legislators in Washington that have voted against every budget increase, and, against every bill that swells the federal deficit? Why not look for someone who has voted, federally, against every piece of legislation that grows the federal government. Pence voted against NCLB, Medicare Part D, TARP, Stimulus, Cash for Clunkers, Ocare, Cap and Trade, and so much more anti-big government legislation.
Its easy to cast votes. Obama proved that.
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:08PM EST (link)Being a legislator does not require personal competence. Nor does it require a lot of skill. Conservative legislators need to navigate the media, but in terms of carrying out their jobs, its not rocket science.
Bottom Line: Legislating is a different skill set than governing. To hire someone to be the chief executive of the largest bureaucracy in the world (in terms of payroll at least) without prior experience of that type is a decision I would not make lightly.
I like my doctor, but I don’t go to him for financial advice, and vice versa.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Jsob- I guess we will just have to disagree
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:14PM EST (link)on what our respective criteria is for who we think would be the best president. I won’t argue what you think is the most important thing, and, I know you will not argue my reasons. Let the best man win, so to speak.
Pawlenty really impressed me this weekend and I can't
Mike gamecock DeVine (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:48PM EST (link)recall ever being greatly at odds with him. Plus, his sequence plan for the debt ceiling issue inspired this:
http://www.redstate.com/gamecock/2011/01/17/selective-shut-down-strategy-better-than-debt-ceiling-bluff/
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” – Andrew Jackson
I like Pawlenty a lot too, GC.
Greg Garrison (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:22PM EST (link)Plus, I understand that he’s laid a lot of groundwork in Iowa.
http://www.thejoyofreason.com
“The art of compromise, which is central to a successful democracy, is not something that people learn overnight.” – Donald Rumsfeld
Oh, and yes, I have repeatedly said that Cain should run and win statewide office first
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:07PM EST (link)People can disagree with that assessment, but in a Republican primary, there are a multitude of options, and I can’t see voting for someone without any political experience.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
What large corporation was Pence in charge of?
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:48PM EST (link)I like Pence alot, but calling a think tank a large corporation is a stretch—both of the word “large” and the word “corporation”.
Does anyone refer to William F. Buckley as a former CEO? He was, but refering to National Review as a corporation is a bit misleading.
Pence’s think tank and WFB’s magazine are both in the politics business. They don’t exactly involve the same kinds of business issues as most businesses.
The Druge Report is a corporation, but I wouldn’t say that Matt Drudge has executive corporate experience.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
I like Cain from what I know but
Bean (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:15PM EST (link)I don’t like Pence for VP, I think the VP should be an end of career spot, not a launch pad for future presidential runs. It puts too much tension between the VP and the President.
I’d rather Pence and other future contenders prove their mettle as executives in their own right (As governors etc.)
Sorry to say it, but
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:45PM EST (link)it sounds as if you are almost accepting defeat in 2016.
2016 is too late.
littlehouse- I think you meant
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:02PM EST (link)that it sounds like accepting defeat in 2012. I agree with you. We need to get Obama out in 2012 or there won’t be a 2016 to even think of. By then Obama will pull a Chavez and declare himself president for life.
I don’t know who you are supporting for 2012, or even if you have decided yet, but, this sisn’t the election year to suggest that any good candidates go run for something else and come back later when you’ve accomplished something else. But, in any political debate, you’ll have that, and usually from people who have a different pony in the race.
Lets not get paranoid
Bean (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:03PM EST (link)Obama has shown no indication of being dictator like., so I am quite sure that in 2016 we will have a regular election.
My opinion would stand regardless of who I support. The reason Pence isn’t my guy now is because he doesn’t have the executive experience that is crucial to being a good president.
Executive experience matters, and Pence doesn’t have it. Executive experience isn’t an end all be all, but it is very very important.
Bean, paranoid doesn't have anything to do with it.
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:10PM EST (link)At any given moment, if the right situation presents itself, President Obama could take the issue of executive authority and run with it the hilt.
If this comes about, what direction do you think this country will go in? And will there be any realistic means of stopping it? After all, the next elections are over 1 and 1/2 years away.
A lot could happen between now and then.
You got it, Scope, I meant 2012. -nt.
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:49PM EST (link)Where do you get that? n/t
Bean (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:52PM EST (link)n/t
It's just that
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:01PM EST (link)if you say a given Republican should wait until 2016, then you are practically assuming a Republican loss in 2012.
At a minimum, you are saying that your current Republican favorite, should he win in 2012, would be a one-termer.
Going on, I say 2016 is too late because of the damage Obama will do in enacting legislation, obstructing Republican repeals, issuing executive orders, executive branch regulations, and court appointments. I don’t think he will try to become a dictator, but he will continue to implement Socialism. This is why I believe the very next presidential election is so very crucial, and that we don’t have time for good people to follow traditional paths. If the situation were not so serious, I might very well agree with your approach.
If you read my post you'd see I said 2016 or 2020
Bean (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 4:59PM EST (link)Realistically I’d want Pence to wait till 2020 anyway because by then he will have proven to be an effective two term governor (which is as discussed the best training for a president)..
I understand, but Pence is not the only one capable of stopping this. He doesn’t have some overwhelming quality that makes him the only one capable of beating Obama.
I like the guy, and I like him for governor of Indiana so that in in 2016 or hopefully 2020 he can run for President if he feels he should.
I Don't Want Pence To Run For Pres. - I Want Him To Run For IN GOV. (nt)
IJB Monday, January 17th at 11:59AM EST (link)Pence for Prez! nt
tdawg89 Monday, January 17th at 12:14PM EST (link)Fingers crossed . . .
conservvoter Monday, January 17th at 12:36PM EST (link). . . that Pence runs for president.
Every time Gallup or PPP says Pawlenty’s the guy it makes me gag. I don’t want to hold my nose when I vote this time around.
I saw Pawlenty on with Wallace yesterday
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:19PM EST (link)and believe me, I don’t think he impressed anyone. It seemed as though he just woke up 5 minutes before the interview.
ps- I do think he will get the doom endorsement though
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:21PM EST (link)from McCain.
Please, Congressman Pence. Run for President!
Spiral (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 12:38PM EST (link)If you, Congressman Pence, do not run for President, we might be stuck with somebody unacceptable to conservatives, like Mike Huckabee or Mitt Romney.
The Obama Bread Lines
Run Mike Run!
bornfreeamerican Monday, January 17th at 12:49PM EST (link)Run Mike Run!
Pence/Jindal; Pence/Ryan FTW!/nt
gracie (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 2:25PM EST (link)Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
Paula (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:12PM EST (link)Pence gave an inspiring speech on The Constitution and the Presidency at Hillsdale College last year (read it here).
“The president is not our teacher, our tutor, our guide or ruler. He does not command us, we command him. We serve neither him nor his vision. It is not his job or his prerogative to redefine custom, law and beliefs; to appropriate industries; to seize the country, as it were, by the shoulders or by the throat so as to impose by force of theatrical charisma his justice upon 300 million others. It is neither his job nor his prerogative to shift the power of decision away from them, and to him and the acolytes of his choosing.”
The speech is brilliant. He doesn’t attack Obama – he attacks his political/ideological philosophy, keeping the rhetoric civil rather than personal. That’s a strategy that will appeal to independents without compromising conservative principals.
Someone asked what Pence has accomplished? How about a 100% rating from the American Conservative Union and National Right to Life? How about voting against his party on such issues as NCLB, TARP and the rest of the bailouts? Ill take that over a big-spending governor with executive experience. He would utterly dismantle Obama in a head-to-head debate.
And, perhaps most important, he has the ability to appeal to both strict fiscal conservatives and die-hard social conservatives without being offensive to either. When both George Will and Tony Perkins can like the same candidate, we have a winner.
Paula
My blog: Bold Colors
Follow me on Twitter: pbolyard
Pence at Hillsdale.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:30PM EST (link)They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
paulkib- Good to see another
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 3:36PM EST (link)Pence supporter that knows a good thing when he sees it. Welcome.
That's wonderful.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:13PM EST (link)Maybe he could be a great speechwriter for another candidate. Like or not, a certain degree of charisma is required to win the support of people all across the nation. This lesson should have been learned with Thompson.
bjw, I think we are seeing through different lenses.
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:03PM EST (link)Pence has a calm, quiet, sober and resolute demeanor which instills calm and confidence. I think this is just what this nation is craving right now in these uncertain times. He appears very presidential to me. and it is clear that he has given very principled thought to the proper execution of that office. People will appreciate this, and will be much less likely to buy into the inevitable smears.
Kowalski -
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:19PM EST (link)You must not have seen the other, animated side of Pence in his CPAC speech posted above.
I watched the speech.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:36PM EST (link)It just didn’t really do it for me. Don’t get me wrong, I would wholeheartedly support him if he won the nomination. I just don’t think he is the best choice, and I think people will lose interest quickly.
Just remember that brilliant speeches is what determined 2008 winner
JSobieski (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:52AM EST (link)Moreover, ratings aren’t exactly an accomplishment.
Did Pence lead efforts for certain kinds of tax reforms?
Did Pence lead efforts to reform entitlements?
Did Pence lead efforts to stop certain things?
I would be curious to learn what leadership roles Pence played during his term in Congress. I like the guy plenty, but voting is easy. I would suggest that Pence’s diehard supporters try to fill us in with some examples of his behind the scenes leadership.
We have quite a few governors who have done fairly well cutting back spending. Limiting your contrast to “big spending” governors is a straw man.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Pence on C-SPAN
Paula (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 4:21PM EST (link)Pence also recently spoke on C-SPAN . His comments in the aftermath of the AZ shooting were well-measured, warning about the dangers of limiting free speech in an effort to make the discourse more civil.
Paula
My blog: Bold Colors
Follow me on Twitter: pbolyard
Here we go again...
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:49PM EST (link)Seeing as how this is more of a top down than a bottom up movement, I predict it will go nowhere. I would bet Cain gets farther than Pence, although neither has enough experience to win the primary in the end.
Oh you must be right
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:57PM EST (link)your candidate of choice, whose lady name shall not be spoken, has so much more relevant experience.
I remember you running your mouth quite often when the very same thing you just said, was said about her. Funny how inexperience or perceived inexperience is not considered relevant when it is your candidate of choice, only when it is another person choice in candidate.
Surprise you did not use this post as yet another spring board for the lady you like. Not like you to pass a chance up to proclaim the godlike status of your candidate. Now if we can just get the Rudy screwball supporter in here to tell us how much we are fools not to get behind such a winner as Rudy.
My candidate's lady name shall be proclaimed loudly and often from the rooftops.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:17PM EST (link)Saraaaaaaah Paaaaaaaaalin!!!
I protested when it was said about Palin because it was not, and is not, and never will be true. On the other hand, it is very true when applied to Pence. Palin had dutifully worked her way up the ladder of elected executive office, something that cannot be said about Pence.
Ahh such a poet
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:36PM EST (link)yet no common sense.
No the correct answer, BJ, would have been, ” I am a hypocrite with little common sense who only holds other candidates to an experience level. I never say a real word about Palin, I only use the same nonsense type words those who adore and worship Obama do. If I were a democrat, I would have also been easily fooled into voting for the “messiah” as well because I have no real knowledge about the things the person that causes me to fall to my knees in adoration has every actually done!”
And again, the very same things you muttered above could easily apply to Palin. No one with a shred of honesty would try to claim she is in the lead when it comes to experience, that is except for you.
You're seriously comparing Palin's experience to Obama's?
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:49PM EST (link)LOL. Lay off the MSM talking points.
Let’s review:
Palin’s experience:
City Council
Mayor
Governor
Pence’s experience:
Talk show host
Congressman
And you seriously mean to tell me you think Pence has more elected executive experience? I think that speaks more to your general intelligence.
As far as other candidates, yes there are a few with similar or slightly more experience like Romney, Barbour, or Huckabee. If those are your candidates, more power to you; you can then criticize Palin for not having as much experience as them. But otherwise, you’re just making a fool out of yourself.
And...
Bill S (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:51PM EST (link)Palin’s experience: Quitter.
Pence’s experience: Not.
“It’s such a fine line between stupid, and clever.” – David St. Hubbins
False.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:19PM EST (link)Palin was promoted. What, are you from the media?
Promoted??
mbecker908 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:23PM EST (link)You need to quit smoking even if you do have a prescription for that funky stuff.
Yep.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:46PM EST (link)She went from being the governor of a sparsely populated state, to a national (and worldwide) media figure, and for all intents and purposes, a presidential candidate. Tell me this, did Sarah Palin have more influence on American politics as governor of Alaska or where she is now?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Bill S (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:03PM EST (link)Man, that’s about the lamest line I’ve heard since she bailed, and I’ve seen plenty of ‘em here. You really are the Palin version of the Ronulans, aren’t you?
The difference between you and me is that I like Palin but am willing to a) consider alternatives and b) admit that she is far from the perfect candidate. I shiv fools like you because you live in a world of fantasy, and comments like you’ve made here simply prove the point.
“It’s such a fine line between stupid, and clever.” – David St. Hubbins
"I shive fools like you"?
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:37PM EST (link)Wow. Just. Wow.
Palin was promoted????
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:28PM EST (link)…promoted to a reality TV show?
Nope
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:56PM EST (link)A dog catcher has more experience. What I am comparing is your constant worshiping, your elevating her to god like status, and your constant hypocrisy and exaggeration of her experience which is what we all saw in the Obama minions. You say nothing of value about her, simply give us the “hope and change” line, then turn around and trash other candidates who are as if not more experienced as your own choice.
But by all means carry on, as so many have said before me, and much more eloquently than I, you are nothing more than a harp and one that does more damage to Palin than anyone else. You have turned more off to her on this site alone than the left could ever hope to.
Absolutely powertothepeople
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:27PM EST (link)I am one of those that had an open mind with respect to Palin. I am so turned off to her now, you have no idea. This is getting like the Ron Paul rabid supporters that actually have done more damage to their guy than their guy already did to himself. I’m at the point that I don’t want to hear her name any more than I want to hear Obama’s name. Never thought I’d get to that point. At this point the best thing Palin can do for the country is to not run.
No, that line won't work either.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:23PM EST (link)We will not shut up about Sarah Palin, ever. Period.
You're a Monty Python skit. nt
mbecker908 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:24PM EST (link)Wow.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:39PM EST (link)Now that was sheer genius. You have convinced me. Pence for president.
I love your approach bjwilson
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:41PM EST (link)please keep it going. You personally have turned off more people here at Redstate to Palin than anyone else that have been supporters. Do you realize, just for a moment, when you pish people off, all you do is to turn more and more people against her. No, I know you don’t get that because you can’t pick your head out of her butt. After I puke in my mouth about Palin at this point, I have to laugh because you just refuse to get it. It’s not us, it’s you. I will now do everything I can to post every negative thing I can say against Palin, on every site I visit. Have a good laugh at that BJ.
Scope, look at it like this.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:17PM EST (link)Three differnt people go to the same dealership on the same day and all three buy identicle cars.
After one thousand miles, they all come in for a checkup, have the dealer look at it for any potential problems, and get an evaluation from the buyers.
The dealer asks the first one how he likes the car.
The owner states that the car runs fine. He sees no problem with it.
It’s not the best he has had, but is it more than acceptible to him.
No problems.
The dealer asks the second buyer how he likes his car.
The owner says that its the best he has ever driven.
He has not had a car so great. he wants to buy another one just like it when this one wears out.
He would recomend this car to all of his friends.
It’s just great.
The dealer asks the third buyer about his car.
The guy tells him it’s a piece of crap.
He tells him he can’t understand why he is selling cars that he thinks are worthless. He wants his money back, but can’t get it.
He has bought the car.
While waiting in the dealers lounge to get thier cars checked,
the three buyers start to talk to each other over coffee about thier cars.
The buyer who thinks that his car is ok, can’t understand why
the other two don’t see what he sees.
He can’t see why the one thinks it’s great, and why the other thinks it’s crap.
The car is just fine.
The buyer that thinks his car is great thinks the other two are missing something he sees, and just think the other two are to stupid or uninformed.
How can they not see how great this car is.
There must be something wrong with them, as they can’t see the obvious.
The buyer who thinks the car is crap knows for sure that the others have a screw loose. And no matter how long and loud he tells the other two about what he sees wrong with the car, he just can’t convince them, and starts to yell louder. These other two are just ignoring the facts about this car.
The buyer that thinks his car is terrible can’t understand why
the other two can’t see that the car is crap.
Three differnt buyers, and all have exactly the same car,
driven the same amount of miles.
Three very different opinions of buyers with the exact same car.
No one of them can change the mind of the other two.
It just seems hopeless to even try.
Now just put Sarah Palin in place of the car,
and you can see where we ar at.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
Excellent story gekster
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:41PM EST (link)and so very correct to the national stage about most candidates. Most of us don’t even know who will be on that stage for sure. We’ve heard names bandied about, yet no one knows for sure yet who will enter that stage. Oh, I really like Pence, and hope that he is on that stage, however, I am having a major problem with those that want to eliminate those that may get on the stage, all so their guy/gal will be the only one standing, even if it means lying against the opposition. It reminds me of the stories about how Obama won the election as Senator in Chicago. He spewed as much dirt against his possible contenders, and even had private records released against his competitors, that he destroyed them as people unnecessarily, just so he was the last man standing, and, therefore a shoe in for the seat. A good debate on the issues is healthy, but, those that are resorting to Obama tactics, or so they think, and are trying to destroy other candidates in order to get their gal the last one standing is disgusting. But, then again, that is politics in 2011. Destroy the opposition at any cost.
It was off the top of my head,
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:53PM EST (link)And now I have even less hair. LOL
But you are right.
Let the Democrats destroy thier rivals.
We shouldn’t be doing that.
But sometimes it appears thats all some of our posters have got.
I wish they wouldn’t tell me what they don’t like about the one they don’t like,
instead tell me WHY they like the one they do.
For some here it is a streatch.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
gekster- As long as you have a
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:22PM EST (link)comb over you are good to go. LOL
Excuse me,
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:11PM EST (link)but where did I ever lie about Pence? He would be my second or third choice, so why would I make something up? Obama tactics? You’re beginning to become delusional.
What, you and powertothepeople?
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:07PM EST (link)Somehow I think anyone who’s not supporting Palin wasn’t going to support her no matter what I said. You’re just trying to shut up Palin supporters so your guy has a better chance. Good luck with the Palin bashing by the way. Out of curiosity, on what blogs do you plan on posting that stuff?
bjwilson83, you're wrong on this one.
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:14PM EST (link)There are people like myself who have been undecided for the most part. We hold ourselves responsible for the choices we make and we WILL make this choice on our own.
We may have been willing to consider Ms. Palin as a candidate, but…you don’t do her favors when you put her so high on a pedestal, bj. We know that no one is as perfect as you portray Ms. Palin to be.
If you want to present her strengths and try to persuade people that she is the best candidate, that’s fine. But the way you’re going about it right now comes across as antagonistic and it sets up people’s backs.
That’s what some folks have been trying to give you a head’s up about, okay?
I understand that point.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:33PM EST (link)I’m also to a point where I’m just sick and disgusted of all the Palin bashing going on. First it was the media with their blood libel. Now other GOP candidates are opportunistically jumping on the bandwagon (for example, Pawlenty) in order to diminish her as a presidential candidate. I just don’t care what anyone says anymore. I’m supporting Palin, and I’m sticking to it. You can disagree with what I say, in fact I enjoy debating the relative merits of the candidates, but I’m just not going to take any of this crap about Palin any more. She deserves better, especially from the right,
You're on the defensive in her behalf
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:40PM EST (link)right now. That’s understandable.
However…do you really want to see her have a chance at getting nominated?
On this site, YOU represent your candidate of choice. If you want other people to see Ms. Palin’s strengths, then you can’t be so emotional about it that you present an unrealistic image of who she is in a manner that is antagonistic.
Think about it!
*Sigh* yes you're right.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:45PM EST (link)I have a hard time playing politics. I just like to say what’s on my mind.
I feel the same way plenty of times,
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:48PM EST (link)and I also know that it isn’t necessarily the wisest thing for me to do to let my feelings get the better me in certain situations.
Just keep it in mind, bj, okay?
So Palin gets your sympathy vote?
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:34PM EST (link)You choose her since she is being unfairly attacked?
Great way to choose the next President.
"You’re just trying to shut up Palin supporters so your guy has a better chance."
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:47PM EST (link)This objection would carry more weight if you hadn’t made it in a post meant to highlight Pence. It also wouldn’t be as ironic had you not started your participation in this thread doing exactly what you object to others doing.
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
Good to see you back Aaron
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:02PM EST (link)I was and am hoping your hiatus was only temporary.
All the will power of Kowalski.
Tbone (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:21PM EST (link)A Redstate mainliner.
I bet your wife logged you in to rid you of the DTs.
Welcome back.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
How is that shutting anyone up?
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:24PM EST (link)I said I PREDICT it won’t go anywhere. Not, “your support of Pence has completely turned me off to him and if you want him to go anywhere you should shut up”. There is just an excessive amount of “concern” about my support for Palin.
Sigh. I should have known better then to waste adult words on you. nt
Aaron Gardner (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:28PM EST (link)conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat
Follow @Aaron_RS
Well, that's a step up from calling me a bot.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:44PM EST (link)You’re improving.
Listen, bjwilson83
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:14AM EST (link)The reason he’s not calling you a bot anymore is that we’ve asked him to stop.
If we ask you to change your behavior, for the good of the site, will you be as generous and understanding as Aaron?
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
What behavior?
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:22AM EST (link)Are you asking me to stop supporting Palin? Have I called someone something I shouldn’t? What? What have I done wrong?
I didn't say you did anything wrong
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:27AM EST (link)I just asked a simple question.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Come on Neil. You know very well
mbecker908 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:29AM EST (link)that for him, that was not a simple question. And it will require an answer pointing out how Palin is Joan of Arc revisited.
Well I'm not just going to give you carte blanche if I don't have to.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:38AM EST (link)I mean, if I’m violating terms of use, site policy, whatever, then sure. But if you’re going to turn around and tell me I can’t ever talk about Sarah Palin then no, I don’t think that’s something I’d want to agree to.
Then this should be simple
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:42AM EST (link)I’m going to ask you, as a favor to the site community, to argue for Sarah Palin without questioning the motives of her critics on this site.
Argue for Sarah Palin without arguing against her critics. Cut the ad hominem stuff.
thanks,
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Further
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:43AM EST (link)Give supporters of other potential candidates the same respect that you expect for your support of your potential candidate.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Sure.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:52AM EST (link)I will do both those the things the moment you make the same requests of those supporters, seeing as how they in fact were the ones showing far greater disrespect by directly calling me a moron, liar, shill, etc. It is difficult to respect people who don’t respect you in return, and are not even asked to hold to the same standard that I am.
BTW
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:56AM EST (link)A good start to promoting an atmosphere of respect on the site would be to tell your fellow moderator Bill S to stop saying things like, “I shiv fools like you”. The double standard is stunning.
Complaints about moderators go to the contact page
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:58AM EST (link)I do not have the authority to do any thing about Bill S, so bringing it up to me is pointless.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
I'm not complaining about his comment,
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:01AM EST (link)because I’m a big boy and can handle mean words. I was just pointing out the double standard, in that I seem to have been singled out to be asked to play nice when everyone else, including moderators, was showing me just as much or more disrespect.
Ok, maybe that one word was a bit much
Bill S (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:14AM EST (link)How about ” poke really hard with a really pointy stick”. Happy now?
I’d think by now you would have figured out that your POV is a bit out touch here, but apparently not.
The rest stands.
“It’s such a fine line between stupid, and clever.” – David St. Hubbins
Ok thanks, apology accepted.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:23AM EST (link)Based on the redstate polls, my POV is very much mainstream. Only Herman Cain every beat Palin in a poll, and not by much.
BJwilson, piece of productive advice for you
JSobieski (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:18AM EST (link)Do some research on the good things Palin did as governor (i.e. did she cut taxes, control spending, cut down on regulations, etc).
Write a diary outlining all the great things she did, and provide links.
You will be doing her far more good that way, than you will with your current approach.
Frankly, as famous of a person as Palin is, her record as governor is relatively unknown.
More light, less heat.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Hmm that's actually quite a good idea.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:24AM EST (link)I’ll get to work.
Willkommen Comrade!
speciallist (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:32PM EST (link)sadly, this BJ isn’t worth it…
Try to understand this
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:09PM EST (link)as it seems you are unable to understand a thing to date.
I have no dog in any of these fights to this point. I have not chosen who I want to run. If I was pushed into a corner and told I had to make a choice, it would be DeMint. I do not form an opinion until the people have announced they are going to run, period. The only thing I will say at this point is there are two who I do not support and that is Romney and Huck, unless they won it all. But I am not a Pence supporter or a Palin hater/non supporter. I do not support anyone at this point as it is an exercise in fruition till we actually know who is going to run.
And please show one post where I have bashed Palin, or you are a liar.There is a huger difference between bashing and questioning your stupidity and attempts to make her our new god. And if that little line is your best attempt at being clever, you should really never attempt clever every again. It was moronic at best.
Can not wait for your next moronic post.
powertothepeople
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:16PM EST (link)he gets it. Read up a bit in this post, please.
Do not count on it
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:18PM EST (link)you are not the first to speak wisdom to him. Moe tried, Aaron tried, in fact most of us tried on numerous threads long before this one. But we shall see………….
Yes, we will, that is true
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:21PM EST (link)bjwilson83 is very passionate in his/her support of Palin, so there could be more times to come when the emotion goes sky high.
We’ll see.
kowalski, of the utmost degree
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:31PM EST (link)I was wrong.
I'm entitled to my opinion.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:31PM EST (link)As I said before, you’re not going to shut me up. I will not shirk from heated debates. I will not pipe down in the face of concern comments from people who oppose Palin. It does not matter to me what you think, or what Aaron thinks (well I know what he thinks, he thinks I’m a bot and that was pretty much all he had to say), or what Moe thinks unless I am violating site policy. I will, however, take lineholders advice and attempt to keep my emotions in check as I engage in debate.
Funny.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:27PM EST (link)You have a lot of anger for a being a DeMint supporter. I was supporting DeMint too until it became clear that he wasn’t going to run. Perhaps you should take lineholders advice and stop calling people names if you want them to take you seriously.
okay, bj, don't you dare put words in my mouth
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:29PM EST (link)you want to dig this hole, it’s yours.
Ahh, so what you said only applies to Palin supporters.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:42PM EST (link)Your concern is noted, and disregarded.
NO, if it was me going off the deep end
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:45PM EST (link)I’d be taking myself to task to an extreme, and if I couldn’t exercise enough of self-control over my emotions to keep from antagonizing people with every other word I said, I’d stand down, back off, whatever was needed.
This is YOUR hole, BJ. You’re digging it, not other people.
I thought you were being genuine.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:50PM EST (link)It is now clear to me that everybody who is telling me to pipe down is not doing so out of concern for Palin’s reputation, but in order to silence her supporters either to advance their candidate, or because they just plain don’t like her. Palin doesn’t give in to those sort of tactics from the media, so neither will I, and neither should her supporters. I will proudly proclaim my conservative ideals and my support for Sarah Palin. Period. End of story.
to those that remember...it's time for the Hinz rule
speciallist (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:00AM EST (link)way past time
We all know what the Hinz rule is.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:17AM EST (link)In fact, if powertothepeople and scope hadn’t jumped all over me in the first place, we wouldn’t be having this discussion.
BJ, I've got as much passion in me
lineholder (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:03AM EST (link)as you do, and maybe even more, which why I know exactly where the emotion comes from. I’ve learned the hard way that it can bring out the worst in me if I let it.
But when it’s all said done, there is very little of anything positive that it accomplishes. There are plenty of other ways to approach situations that are better, smarter and wiser in the long run.
That’s why I do what I can to keep my emotions in check and why I tried to encourage you to do the same.
Funny how you singled ME out.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:14AM EST (link)Not a peep about powertothepeople or scope, even though they were actually calling me names, etc. At first I though you were genuinely concerned about Palin’s reputation. I lost interest in what you have to say when you revealed your double standard.
it doesnt matter BJ
kyle8 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:08AM EST (link)she still isn’t going to leave her husband for you.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
it doesnt matter BJ
kyle8 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:08AM EST (link)she still isn’t going to leave her husband for you.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
You may not shut up
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:41PM EST (link)but there will come a day, and it is coming fast, where Palin cult members such as yourself are banned on sight just like the Ron Paul ones. And that is a shame since Ron Paul is a scumbag and Palin has a lot of good points. But dummies just can not understand that there are other things in life to discuss other than her, never figure out we are not here for a sales pitch and a piss poor one at that, never figure out to stop with the constant exaggerations, and can not figure out it has past obnoxious long ago and they will cause the name of Palin combined with any adjectives to be a see you later word.
But I could be wrong, since you have pissed off every mod and even the owner, you may just wear out your welcome, get kicked, and things will sort of go back to normal since you are the most obnoxious cult member on the site.
You are assuming facts not in evidence.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:57PM EST (link)every one is allowed to state thier mind.
And tone down the language.
My Grandkids read this site, and all are under 18.
Do you kiss your girlfriend with that filthy mouth.
And if you keep it up, you might be the one gone instead of the Palinbots.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
He does the best he can
Tbone (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:29PM EST (link)with what he has to work with. I am proud of him for not falling victim to a Pick-up Sticks addiction or watching South Park on a loop cassette.
BTW, His girlfriend doesn’t mind, she wipes clean with a damp cloth.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
Is this snark Gekster?
powertothepeople (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 6:28PM EST (link)I know joke of the day below, and not referring to his posts, acted the parrot part, but what are you talking about?
Tone down the language? What language? Are you referring to the word pissed? I know you could not be since you made this post not worthy of children’s eyes if we are basing it on piss being too much.
“So your basic reason is to come here and be a rectal orafice.”
The rest you can go look at.
So based on that post, this must be snark cause you have never seemed to be pious or a hypocrite. Because by God, if the word piss is enough to send you off on a tangent and worry about your grandkids, I would have to assume someone stole your account and wrote the post I listed above, right?
So I will just assume it is snark and your attempt at some humor rather than think worse about you.
The rest of your post is in the same category…….
And thanks for the concern about my account, but do not fret, I keep myself right inside the line of rules, so I am fine. But thank you for the concern.
Take it any way you want.
gekster (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 6:45PM EST (link)But I think your posts would carry more weight without the four letters.
Why you feel the need, I don’t know.
Does it make you feel more grown up.
Do yo think it will impress others.
Do you think no one will read your words unless you use them.
Like I said, I don’t know.
Go ahead and thnk the worse about me, but the next time my 8 year old grandkid Samuel asks my why someone has to use words like that,
I’ll send him to you.
(now that was snark.)
As to the reference from below, he proved himself as such and has become a ghost.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
She is not running
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:44PM EST (link)her days in politics are done for the time being, maybe even for good. She is going to remain in the cameras pushing candidates across the line, but that is it. I am waiting for the tears and anger from the cult members as soon as she makes it official.
Oh please.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:22PM EST (link)If you’d been around here much lately you would have seen everything I said of value about her. Hint: I wrote a highly recommended diary about it. Your establishment-like tactics to marginalize Palin based on her sky high popularity will not work.
Palin's sky high popularity is your dream
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:49PM EST (link)and if you were honest at all, you would also recognize that she has even higher negative ratings. I suspect the newer polls will put her even higher in the negative segment, as she just can’t help herself but to inject herself on the national stage, even if she has to use the victim role to get there. She is done, put a fork in her, she is well done. Bye bye Sarah. You could have been a good champion for conservatism. She will never last the lastest media barage against her, even among those on the right. Have at it bjwilson, and know that you are a part of her demise as a candidate.
Let's see.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:20PM EST (link)She was the only person in the 2008 race to draw crowds as big as Obama’s. She’s written two books, appears regularly on Fox news, and has her own highly-rated reality show. The media hangs on her every word, facebook post, and twitter account. She is one of America’s most admired women (after Hillary, I think). And you’re telling me she’s not popular? LOL. You obviously have some sort of grudge against her. It’s ok, get it all out. Then start thinking rationally, and maybe you’ll come back around to like her.
She is popular?
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:40PM EST (link)There is more than one kind of popularity, you know.
One is in a likable way. Another is in a notorious way.
And one is in the curious way. Those who fall into that category would be the tabloid stars like Kate Gosselin, Linsey Lohan and the others that people watch but don’t necessarily like or respect.
Whats your point?
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:36PM EST (link)I read your nonsense, was not at all impressed. Neither were the mods, the owner of the site who is a Palin fan and friend, nor were any other reasonable people.
And oh boy, you got some recs. You must be king of all diary writers. Did yours get to front page….mine did mine did mine did. Are we front page pals? Freakin moron. You could write a Ron Paul for president diary and get more recs, so the recs matter little as the Palin cult members come out of the woodwork anytime her name is mentioned.
And sky high popularity, are you joking? Please, pull your head from your ass as you are not speaking rationally. She holds the least, and yes that is the word least, favorable ratings of ALL the contenders or possible contenders.
Ignorance may be bliss, but your level of ignorance is just obnoxious.
I see you're a Palin fan.
gekster (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:43PM EST (link)So who do you want for her VP?
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
Ok folks, 2012 is here. Get involved
The "owner of the site" has a name,
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:22PM EST (link)and it is Erick Erickson. In fact, he also wrote this diary. You don’t sound like you are very familiar with him. But yes, he is supporting Pence. Duh. So now all the Palin supporters on this site are morons and cult members? Really?
For being a
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:57PM EST (link)graduate student in mathematics, you really are not that bright are you?
Who cares who wrote this diary, that is not the subject we are talking about. And since you knew his name, proves I do not need to list every name as the title was just fine.
And no one claims every Palin supporter are morons or cult members. I am pretty sure we directed it at you and those who act like you. There are many Palin supporters on here with a ton of class and tact, you just seem to have none. Now if you want to play stretch what I say game, stretch this….your are number one member of the moron Palin cult club.
See, the reason you are a moron cult member is because you run around to most posts and instead of discussing the merits of the post, you jump up and shout Palin. You are a member of the club because your head is in your rear and firmly at that. You are a member because you come to this post and actually have the audacity to state Pence is not worthy due to his lack of experience yet you constantly whine that others say the same thing about Palin. You are a member of the club because you never state facts about Palin, both pro and con, you exaggerate her and her experience/ability. This is why you and your message is a joke and is why you have turned off so many to Palin. And what makes it an even bigger joke is she is not running, will not be running this time, may never run for president in the future. She will not be a contender much less the nominee. So welcome to the Ron Paul status you have earned time after time.
HINT: if you really respect her and like her the way you claim, then shut up. You are making her the next Ron Paul with your incessant BS and that does her no favors. So either you have some serious issues with the level of “adoration” you have for the woman, or you are too stupid to see how you damage her.
I thought we couldn't call people morons anymore.
Tbone (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:34PM EST (link)Did I miss a new memo or did you miss the old one?
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
I think that post speaks for itself.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:35PM EST (link)Ladies and gentlemen, the great powertothepeople. (Although, come to think of it, he or she doesn’t really seem to care much what the people think.)
Wow bjwilson83
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 12:45AM EST (link)You had a case there but you had to reply in kind. Ease up will you?
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
I love how you keep blaming
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:20PM EST (link)the MSM for being the only ones against Palin. Have you left your comfort/spin zone lately to see that there are at least as many Republicans against a Palin presidency as there are leftists against her? No, I didn’t think so. Have you noticed lately that Pence has been on the rise, and Palin has been on the decline? No I didn’t think so. Too bad. You are really in for a very big letdown.
I repeat what Bill said-
Palin=Quitter
Pence=Still in the fight.
Interesting that one of her big supporters, Bill Kristol, said this weekend that she damaged herself by putting herself out there wrongly, and, at the wrong time. She is so very overexposed, and, couldn’t even take a little break from being in our faces yet again, this time as a victim. She will never learn that less is better. She herself keeps giving the MSM talking points, but, you refuse to see that she desperately needs to just shut up already, and so do many of her supporters. I’ve said before, and I will say it again, Ron Paul’s supporters were actually worse than the kook himself. The rabid Palin supporters are accomplishing the same disaster with her.
Yes, there are quite a few people in the GOP that don't like her.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:30PM EST (link)Most of them are establishment types who would prefer a more moderate candidate. Maybe someone like Olymia Snowe? Or Mike Castle, yeah that guy was great. With all due respect to Erick, Pence is on the rise about as much as Thompson was. He is simply a top down pick intended to replace Palin that generates very little enthusiasm. He’ll fade fast.
You yourself are starting to sound a lot like the left. If she didn’t say anything you would have criticized her for not being able to respond. Now that she did respond in a very good manner, you accuse her of what, defending herself? The whole “Palin = Paul” thing will not fly either. Palin has a vastly different base of support than Paul, better executive experience, and just generally is not crazy. And supporting a presidential candidate is not a crime. It will accomplish no such disaster. But your “concern” is noted.
Can't fight dumb
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:00PM EST (link)and when you add obstinate and stubborn to dumb, there really is no reason to try to keep fighting dumb and stubborn. bjwilson you are totally qualified as both
see above
carolina Monday, January 17th at 8:47PM EST (link)Americans like Palin more after her video response
Really????
ruexperienced Monday, January 17th at 11:44PM EST (link)I don’t believe that.
Actually at this time, Obama has more...nt.
NightTwister (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:23PM EST (link)The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter. – Winston Churchill
Prior to his election of course.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:33PM EST (link)We’re talking about what it takes to get elected president.
bjwilson- I love how you erase most of Pence's life
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:32PM EST (link)and conveniently relegate the most of his life to the trash heap. That is pathetic. Actually it is as pathetic as your constant shilling for Palin. Why do I get the feeling that Ron Paul will soon surpass Palin in the polls? Gee, I think you and your buddies will do it all on your own.
If candidates were judged solely by redstate supporters,
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:34PM EST (link)you would certainly doom Pence.
You know they used to ban Paul supporters on sight
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:08PM EST (link)for exactly your behavior. I have faith that at some point you will do yourself in. I just turned Palin off of my TV. Don’t want to hear a word she says. My husband feels the same. So do all his work buddies. She’s an opportunist, period, end of story. Please keep posting your accolades as you have. It will add to her stage left exist off the national stage. Hahahahahaha.
The day redstate bans me for supporting for Palin
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:53PM EST (link)is the day I don’t want to blog at redstate ever again. Thankfully, I believe the moderators realize that were they to ban every Palin supporter, they would lose half the community. I think you’re just jealous of Palin.
They do not ban supporters
powertothepeople (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:00PM EST (link)even of Ron Paul. They ban morons, shills, idiots, and other type people who never learn to shut up and talk about something else. And most would assume once banned, you would not want to blog there anymore.
Well, then I guess you won't be around long.
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 11:39PM EST (link)Good luck with that vitriol.
You Can't Be Serious?
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:01PM EST (link)She’s an opportunist for defending herself after being smeared for being an accessory to murder?
Would you have preferred that she just shut her mouth and go away after being smeared by a bunch of leftist hacks?
Yes, that is exactly what I am saying
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:28PM EST (link)She had unprecedented support on this issue, even by some who were never in her camp. She should have let the right keep on defending her, as they were. She lost a golden opportunity. Now those that came out in support of her have been turned off yet once again. There is a time to stay quiet, especially when others are more successfully fighting your battle for you. She was late to the party, and only opened her mouth to exchange feet in this case.
You Call It Late To The Party
silentcal2012 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:33PM EST (link)Other people called it being respectfull. Even moderates who usually bash Palin like O’Reilly and Krauthammer had her back here.
When you accuse someone of being complicit in murder, that person has every right to defend themselves. To call that opportunistic is shameful.
Krauthammer did not support her
Scope (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 8:00AM EST (link)when he was on with O’Reilly. He clearly stated that everyone else came out to support her against those attacking her, and, that she should have remained quiet and in the background and out of the fray. It was his opinion that by coming out with the video, and when she did, she just opened herself up to the attack machine yet again. He said that the flak was beginning to quiet down, and she only gave them more fuel to restart the fire again.
Now I understand she is making additional statements to defend her blood libel comment. She just can’t seem to help herself. I’m actually getting the feeling that she loves the limelight, even when it’s against her.
Easy for You to Say
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 10:44AM EST (link)That Palin should’ve just kept quiet. Next time you’re accused of being an accessory to murder, I’d like to see how you respond.
Face it: Palin can’t win with some people. She gets criticized for not saying anything, then she’s bashed for responding too soon, then for responding at all.
It’s beyond ridiculous!
No one's saying
aesthete (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 6:53PM EST (link)that Palin had no right to defend herself, simply that a) other people were doing it for her, and b) her defending herself kept the issue in the center when it was dead and dying, and gave the left a new angle of attack.
I cut Palin some slack on the issue, since it was the left that brought Palin into it (and she does have a right to defend herself), but I agree with Krauthammer that there was no need for her to respond.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
This Would be the Same Krauthammer
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Wednesday, January 19th at 8:26AM EST (link)That did the following:
1. The GOP is better off leaving Obamacare in place.
2. Basically fell all over himself praise Obama for his Tucson speech
3. Supported the only candidate who could win in Fla, in Charlie Crist
4. Criticized Palin for bringing up Death Panels
5. Said the Tea Party should’ve “toned it down” during the townhalls over Obamacare
6. Worker for Carter.
I don’t trust CK’s judgment on anything.
I respect a real conservative who has the backbone to defend herself. The left and her many critics on sites like this, would’ve criticized Palin no matter what she did. Had she not responded she would’ve been too weak or even admitting some guilt for not defending herself. It was a no win situation, but once again Palin rose above it unrattled and is refusing to shut up.
Leaders like her are very rare. How many others have spoke out against the attack on conservatives over Tucson? Just look this past week where Pawlenty took a cheap shot at her saying he wouldn’t have used crosshairs and Newt saying she needs to think more carefully about what she says!
No other conservative candidate has withstood more criticism and hatred that Palin but has refused to back down.
All good conservatives owe it to themselves to give Palin a fair shot if she runs instead of automatically writing her off now because she’s supposedly “radioactive”.
He’s part
concap (Diary) Wednesday, January 19th at 8:48AM EST (link)of the fair and balanced. There has to be someone representing the other side.
The Constitution is neither Right or Left, it is American.
You need neither be Right or Left to vote American.
When you vote on the Federal level based on politics, you are voting for a lobbyist to promote your own personal wants and force them on others through taxation and legislation.
FF/FS/SL/RMIL/OK
Fiscal Federal/Fiscal State/Social Local/Retired Military/Oath Keeper
You Can't Be Serious About Palin Is Right
silentcal2012 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 10:14PM EST (link)This is an absurd statement. There is a difference between deciding whether Sarah Palin is the best candidate, the most competent candidate and the most viable candidate… and calling her nothing but and opportunist.
I doubt I’ll support in 2012, but I value her contributions to the conservative cause and respect her as a sincere woman who has the courage of her convictions. Too bad more politicians didnt have her courage.
Whether you think whe should be president or not, here is a fact, she has done more for the conservativism and conservative candidates in the last two years than Mike Pence and Herman Cain in their whole lives combined.
She has earned our respect if not our support. That she should be the object of such scorn is disgusting.
I Wouldn't Say She's Done More For Conservatism Than Pence...
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 10:52AM EST (link)but what politician or potential candidate has done more to fight back against the Arizona shooting smears over the last week? Where were Pence, Romney, Barbour, Gingrich, etc? They should’ve strongly rallied around a fellow conservative for being falsely attacked. They need to realize that if the left is able to do this to one conservative, they’ll be able to do this to them all.
I respect what Pence has done overall. I like that he was against TARP and Medicare Part D to name a few things. I just don’t think he’s going to run at this point. If he did I’d strongly consider him since I like his convictions.
Just like I hope many on here will strongly consider Palin over the likes of Romney, Newt, and Huckabee.
Done More
silentcal2012 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:51PM EST (link)Doing more requires more than being right on the issues. Both TARP and Medicare passed. Outside websites like this, Pence is largely a non-factor. . The ability to lead, inspire and communicate and other attributes are key. A lot of average joes believe the right things, but few have introduced millions to a new consrevatism, raised millions for conservative candidates, inspired legions of activists like Palin. Pence has done very little compared to Palin.
You've Got a Point Silentcal2012
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 3:39PM EST (link)Also, Rush said today that very few people would be able to withstand the amount of garbage thrown her way and still come on unraveled, still fighting hard for conservatism. Far too many GOP politicians simply cave even at the slightest sign of trouble. We really need a leader with some backbone and that’s exactly what Sarah is.
I hope you’ll support her if she runs.
I was leaning Pence, but Palin’s leadership and resolve has put me strongly in her corner. I will go door to door for this woman, she is exactly what we need as our next POTUS!
Hahahaha, you really don't do comedy very well nt
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:15PM EST (link)I vow from this moment forward
Scope (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:19PM EST (link)that I will never again respond to any bjwilson post. No reason to try to engage the dumb and the blind. There is no there there.
You're off to a great start...
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:55PM EST (link)with a triple Kowalski.
Read this. Will Pence really bow out?
melissatx (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 5:52PM EST (link)http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/01/signs_point_to_mike_pence_bowi.html
Too bad. He was my first choice.
If he goes, I will look at Paul Ryan, real close.
But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever. John Adams
I think Pence should take the long view.
the_invisible_hand (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 6:47PM EST (link)He’s a young man. Be governor of Indiana, gain executive experience, and avoid this primary which promises to be brutal.
I have no idea why Pence would want to run the gamut of risks this primary offers when he can easily wait in the wings.
In 2016 he might have to fight Huntsman and Rubio, but this year he’s going to have to deal with Palin, Romney, Huckabee, Gingrich, Barbour, and every other heavyweight that has higher name recognition and more favors to call in.
Pence will be this season’s Fred Thompson. A candidate pushed in before he was ready by an enthusiastic, but small minority of the intelligent base.
The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn’t work and then they get elected and prove it.
-P. J. O’Rourke
There is another way of looking at this.
lineholder (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:26PM EST (link)2012 could be the best opportunity conservatives will have to get a conservative into the WH. We have growing agreement with our principles among the general public and I wouldn’t take for granted that this will be as true for the 2016 elections as it is now.
The greater majority of us have very little trust or faith in our government any more. If we approach this with a determination to prove to the general public that conservatives can be the kind of leaders that this country genuinely needs, this could carry over into elections for many years to come and completely change the scope of what goes on in politics in our nation.
But this all depends on getting the right people elected…people who are willing to stand by conservative principles. people who will support the Constitution of the United States of America, people who will put everything they are on the line to turn things around.
That’s asking a lot out of anyone, but in the context of his character, Mike Pence does have what it takes to succeed.
Pence would be an outstanding addition to the roster
andysmith (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:21PM EST (link)of potential GOP nominees. I’m a little more inclined to favor governors more than congressmen/senators for the office of the Presidency, but someone principled like DeMintt or Pence would be more than okay with me.
Unfortunately, as much as I love and respect Sarah Palin, there is NO WAY she can mount an effective campaign with all of the media trash thrown at her, so I have to think she’s out.
I’m still thinking Mitch Daniels is the guy, but I’m also liking Chris Cristie the more I see him and Herman Cain will turn A LOT of heads if he goes through with running.
“Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. ”
“Government’s first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. ”
“Governments tend not to solve problems, only to rearrange them.”
-The great Ronald Reagan
www.rightreality.wordpress.com
Pence would be an outstanding addition to the roster
andysmith (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:21PM EST (link)of potential GOP nominees. I’m a little more inclined to favor governors more than congressmen/senators for the office of the Presidency, but someone principled like DeMintt or Pence would be more than okay with me.
Unfortunately, as much as I love and respect Sarah Palin, there is NO WAY she can mount an effective campaign with all of the media trash thrown at her, so I have to think she’s out.
I’m still thinking Mitch Daniels is the guy, but I’m also liking Chris Cristie the more I see him and Herman Cain will turn A LOT of heads if he goes through with running.
“Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. ”
“Government’s first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. ”
“Governments tend not to solve problems, only to rearrange them.”
-The great Ronald Reagan
www.rightreality.wordpress.com
Love her or hate her, Palin can no way run.. for one simple reason..
ladyimpactohio (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 7:35PM EST (link)In light of recent events she can’t be protected. And neither can her family.
We the people tell government what to do, it does not tell us.–Ronald Reagan in his farewell speech
You know they have security on presidential campaigns. nt
bjwilson83 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 8:36PM EST (link)Pence will be perfectly positioned for 2016
thurman Monday, January 17th at 8:44PM EST (link)I’d love to have a chance to vote for him in the primary now, but this field will be a mess for a guy like him starting behind in terms of name recognition, money, etc
The 2016 field will be wide open, and arguably with no one remotely electable on the Dem side also.
I think he sees the path of least resistance as waltzing into the Governor’s mansion, building a bigger national profile over the next 4 years, and being a strong, if not the top, contender in 2016 with 4 years as Gov now on his resume, and a lot less intimidating primary field
I will vote for him in a second if he runs, but the stars seem to be aligning for him to be Gov now and be a big player in 2016, possibly even the man to beat then.
As noted above,
littlehouse18 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:41PM EST (link)you too must be giving up on 2012.
Erick what about Paul Ryan for President
pamp Monday, January 17th at 9:15PM EST (link)I never his name mentioned as a potential presidential candidate, yet he is a rising star who is getting more exposure each day. His roadmap, although not perfect, is more than I have seen from any other candidate. He was outstanding debating Obama during the “bipartisan” healthcare debate at Blair House.
My fear is that the RNC will support another McCain sort instead of the young gun that we need.
It's not just the lack of executive experience
georgeinla (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:20PM EST (link)It’s also that he’s never won a statewide office. How hard is it to maintain a “pure” conservative voting record when you represent an R+10 district in rural/ex-urban Indiana? The guy votes his district’s views, makes a couple of good speeches, and now he’s qualified to be the standard bearer for conservatism and the Republican Party in 2012?
With Lincoln being the exception that proves the rule, it’s not accidental that Governors have made the best Presidents, and, barring that, Senators.
The Party has already cleared the field for him for the Indiana Governor’s office. The logical thing for him to do would be to run for that, make his mark as both a statewide winner, and an executive officeholder, and then we can check back in with him in 2016 and see how he’s making out.
Hi. I am a moby Greenie lawyer from Los Angeles who was not nearly smart enough to hide my tracks. Please assess my opinions accordingly.
If You Think Pence Will Be Immune to the Smears Erick You are Sadly Mistaken
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:28PM EST (link)I believe Erick Erickson first posted not even two weeks ago that he loved Palin but she has been made “radioactive”.
I think that’s a really bad reason not to support someone. If the left has proven anything, it’s that as soon as a real conservative becomes a serious threat to them that they will stop at nothing to attempt to destroy them.
Does anyone honestly think that if Pence became a serious POTUS contender that the left wouldn’t make him “radioactive” too?
I don’t think we should be intimidated into who we support by the left.
Although the Internet is comprised of 1's and 0's, politics is not
JSobieski (Diary) Monday, January 17th at 9:58PM EST (link)Radioactivity is not a 1 or 0 thing.
And the key is radioactivity among independents.
My rules of the road for primary season.
Rule #1: Vote for YOUR first choice in the primaries
Rule #2: Vote for the R in the general.
Rule #3: Don’t let anyone convince you to violate Rule #1 or Rule #2
Rule #4: When in a center-right argument, reaffirm Rules #1-#3–it will help us all to get along better.
Rule #5: If you are using the language of the left, you probably aren’t furthering conservativism
Rule #6: The priority is issues first, candidates second, and supporters third. Nobody is bigger than the issues. Conversely, if you spend your time focusing on supporters, you are wasting everyone’s time.
STOP THE MADNESS!
A reduction in the rate of spending increases is NOT a cut!
In-state tuition for illegals is NOT amnesty!
Requiring someone to pay their medical bills is NOT an individual mandate!
Reducing tax rates is NOT a tax increase!
Palin will be more effective...
haumea (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:11AM EST (link)…as a decoy. She can draw enemy fire and resources effectively during the campaign.
But I suspect that Palin and her family
bjwilson83 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:26AM EST (link)will not appreciate being the one taking all the death threats. Especially after this week.
Well...
haumea (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 5:54AM EST (link)…the only way to avoid that is to forego having any influence on Us politics. Last night on Hannity she said she wouldn’t “shut up”, so her position seems clear…
She's Going to Run and Win
NHConservative0227 (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 10:41AM EST (link)nt
Just because they will stop at nothing
aesthete (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 6:57PM EST (link)does not mean that they will succeed: see the Teflon President, Chris Christie, Bob McDonnell, Rudy Guiliani (uh-oh, shouldn’t have said the name:) ), and many, many others.
The act of defending any of the cardinal virtues has today all the exhilaration of a vice – G.K. Chesterton
My 2 bits
altexas Monday, January 17th at 9:42PM EST (link)We have a good selection of Conservatives for our next candidate for President of the United States. We will compare and contrast them, we will listen to them debate and wiegh their views. I see no reason in this rich Conservative climate to violate the ‘Reagan Rule’ which simply states, ” thou shall not speak ill of a fellow Republican.”
If the (R) stands for RINO, maybe there is an exception but I am not seeing that in our front runners. Pence, Palin, Cain etc. Alll will get my support if nominated. Team them up in any combination you like; Pence/Palin, Pence/Cain, Cain/Palin, Palin/Pence…you get my idea. No offense meant to other good men/women.
Focus on making our historic President Obama, history.
For my part
altexas Monday, January 17th at 9:45PM EST (link)I am making arrangements to actively support Heman Cain. Love Sarah, and no problem with Mike. Let’s just be honest and ….wait for it…..civil.
To paraphrase Fonzie...
haumea (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 1:02AM EST (link)“I like Mike…My bike likes Mike…”
Look, I know conservatives like “tradition.” But occasionally you have to dispense with tradition and think out of the box.
In my gut, I feel that Pence “gets it.” He “gets it” about the left and he “gets it” about what’s at stake over the next decade.
Those other guys? Sorry, I’m not feeling that they get it, no matter how experienced they are at management.
The next president will have to wage war to restore our republic. Perhaps without pyrotechnics, but certainly in substance. Too much is at stake to elect a squishy manager who will allow the left to get away with murder as usual. This must not come to pass.
This thread is about Pence
txgho1911 Tuesday, January 18th at 1:47AM EST (link)All of the repeated detraction of Palin is killing the topic at hand. Discussion of Palin deserves an independent diary post.
Sarah Palin scares the dems and left more than any other individual in history. She is taking on the job of promoting and support in ways the RNC and other entities have dropped the ball. She resigned to stop a left political attack policy that AK rules forced legitimacy on every possible complaint against the office. She did not quit a fight. She ended the fight in avenues that handicapped her effectiveness in every successful campaign she participates in.
This is correct
Neil Stevens (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 2:14AM EST (link)I’m really going to start policing this more. Threadjacking is not allowed at RedState.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
Well, in all fairness...
Bill S (Diary) Tuesday, January 18th at 10:44AM EST (link)the “threadjack” in this diary was very gradual. Don’t know that you can put a finger on where the problem started. Whenever one brings up a potential 2012 nominee, it’s inevitably going to degenerate into a pissing match over who’s the best choice.
“It’s such a fine line between stupid, and clever.” – David St. Hubbins