Liz Cheney’s new group has a very effective ad out:
How effective is it? Sweet Little Lindsey from South Carolina has his knickers in a wad crying foul on behalf of the Obama Administration.
Some lawyers are out there saying this is an unfair attack on the lawyers Barack Obama hired because everyone is entitled to zealous representation.
Let me tell you why America is so great, folks. In America, there are all sorts of people making up a diverse mindset and sharing varied opinions. The legal system reflects that.
There will always be lawyers willing to defend the indefensible. And if you are a lawyer willing to defend the indefensible you can get really rich and/or really infamous. Some of them are there just because they like the challenge.
Typically, however, the lawyers willing to defend the indefensible are from the far left — particularly when defending those who are at war with America.
Good for them for being willing to have a niche in the legal field. But it says something not about them, but about the Obama administration that Barack Obama would put these same attorneys into the Department of Justice.
Liz Cheney’s advertisement and her points on the issue have very little to do with the lawyers themselves. The people raising hell and claiming offense at the attack are obfuscating the point. This is a question about the President’s judgment and that of his Attorney General.
Liz Cheney is right.
Neil Stevens
Daniel Horowitz
Steve Maley
As citizens, we have a right to know who is working at DOJ,
Old_Crow (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 7:46AM EST (link)as well as their background and opinions on relevant legal matters. Some of these recent hires are on record supporting release of GITMO prisoners regardless of concerns about the terrorists returning to the battlefield.
Ideas matter, word view matters, especially for attorneys at the DOJ who are supposed to be helping defend this country. I’m actually to the right of Liz Cheney on this one, and think these folks need to be exposed and fired – they, or others with a similar background, have no business being employed by the taxpayers.
I wonder if the Obama administration would be so open minded as to hire folks from ACLJ or attorneys who have a pro-life Christian world view?
“Enlightened statesmen will not always be at the helm.” — James Madison
I highly Recommend Ann Coulter's Article Today
mdd1956 Thursday, March 11th at 2:34PM EST (link)http://www.anncoulter.com/
Strongly disagree
newsflash (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:01AM EST (link)To smear DOJ employees as jihad sympathizers is disgusting. If Liz Cheney has evidence she’d like to share with the country, I’d invite her to put it out there. Absent that, this is a baseless smear.
Disgusting.
Perpetual war is great and all, but who’s going to pay for it?
Here's a flash for you stupid...
mbecker908 (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:07AM EST (link)The DoJ employees in question ARE jihad sympathizers.
Your mask is slipping.
Got proof, big guy?
newsflash (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:23AM EST (link)Got any? Oh, they’re doing their jobs you say? Well shoot, I guess just about anyone doing their job down at GITMO is a terrorist sympathizer too. What an asinine concept! I can’t wait to see your ad.
Perpetual war is great and all, but who’s going to pay for it?
Maybe you'd allow them into your home , but...
rivahmitch Thursday, March 11th at 10:01AM EST (link)Sorry. There’s a BIG jump between saying that scum is entitled to Constitutional rights (actually a questionable proposition in this case) and saying “I’ll personally protect the scum”. Some proclivities speak loudly for themselves. As we used to say in another era “If it waddles like a duck, quacks like a duch and is found in the middle of a flock of ducks, it’s probably not an eagle.”
G'bye
Neil Stevens (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:54AM EST (link)That’s enough out of you.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
pushing back on jihad sympathizer label
tankertodd (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 9:36AM EST (link)Nothing in the ad is suggesting these are jihad sympathizers. Remember that John Adams, Founding Father, represented the British who fired in the Boston Massacre. I absolutely agree though that their names need to be provided.
Once you have the names, THEN you’ll start to build the picture of just how bad these guys are, and how strongly we feel having them in DoJ is a bad idea. I imagine John Adams would not approve of a lawyer with a political agenda. Just need to take it in steps.
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The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race – Chief Justice Roberts
tired of that narrative
hickorystick (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:53AM EST (link)Adams also implemented the Alien and Sedition Act. Congressman Lyons (Irishman) was imprisoned under this act; but was re-elected while in prison. When the next Presidential election resulted in a tie, guess who the deciding vote was? Hello President Thomas Jefferson!
Huh?
Neil Stevens (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:10AM EST (link)The tie was between Jefferson and his running mate.
And are you saying you had a problem with either the Alien act or the Sedition act? I sure don’t.
RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
No, I don't so much
hickorystick (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:49AM EST (link)My problem is the narrative of Adams as some enlightened purist who defended dislikable characters, solely for the principle. I’m getting tired of the story becoming about defending a principle, instead of focusing on the heinousness of the crime.
Um...the tie between Jefferson and Burr came down to a vote in the House of Representatives...
kyoufuu (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:19AM EST (link)Article 2, Section 1.3: “and if there be more than one who have a such majority, and have an equal number of votes, then the House of Representatives shall immediately choose by ballot one of them for President.”
“There are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations.” — James Madison
“I swear by my life, and my love of it, that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.”
Wow. I completely misread what you wrote. Scratch my correction (nt)
kyoufuu (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:21AM EST (link)“There are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations.” — James Madison
“I swear by my life, and my love of it, that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.”
this is what I'm referencing
hickorystick (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:55AM EST (link)http://www.answers.com/topic/matthew-lyon
I wasn’t completely clear
Viewpoint Censorship?
jimwzdp (Diary) Thursday, March 11th at 10:48AM EST (link)Banning newsflash has to be the most egregious act of viewpoint censoring I’ve ever seen on a site that purports to invite comments on articles.
Whether you agree with him or not (and I don’t), people can disagree on what the real issue is on the subject. But throwing somebody out for disagreeing with the apparent consensus on this site?
Sad….
The DOJ employees who are being smeared
youthgrunt (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 9:54AM EST (link)are the ones not releasing the names, not the individuals themselves. The issue here, I think, is not necessarily that lawyers who worked pro bono for the terrorists are working at DOJ, but we don’t even know what they are working on AT the DOJ.
The DOJ has said that they would not be working on cases that they were part of before coming to DOJ, but the fact that they made the choice to do pro bono work for terrorists means that they should be disqualified from doing any work on terrorism, etc.
Elections have consequences. We are getting the DOJ that we elected–and that includes liberal, bleeding heart lawyers. But that doesn’t mean that we cannot require ethical behavior on the part of the administration.
9 Jihad Advocates is hardlya fair representation of the country's attitudes toward the WOT.
Veronica (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:06AM EST (link)And what smear?
Liz was accurate in portraying:
a.) Holder’s views
b.) Holder’s secrecy.
An added bonus:
c.) How Holder’s DOJ represents anti-American”Perpetual War! Who’s going to pay for it?!” progressives like you.
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Pray as if everything depends on God, and work as if everything depends on us. – St. Augustine
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There is no legal right to counsel in a habeas corpus case.
Old_Crow (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:44AM EST (link)“The legal profession’s depiction of these lawyers as heroic servants not of the enemy but of the Constitution is unmitigated nonsense: You can’t be performing a vital constitutional function when the function is not required by the Constitution. They can repeat the lie a million times, but that won’t make it a fact. These lawyers made a conscious decision to contribute their services, usually gratis, to enemy combatants with whom the American people are at war.”
Rest of McCarthy’s column:
http://article.nationalreview.com/42…rew-c-mccarthy
These attorneys were voluntarily helping the enemy of this country. They should not be employed by the taxpayers and work in the DOJ.
Every one should be fired immediately.
“Enlightened statesmen will not always be at the helm.” — James Madison
My post was in reply to newsflash's drooling nonsense
Old_Crow (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 8:49AM EST (link)“Enlightened statesmen will not always be at the helm.” — James Madison
Bravo, Liz et al! /nt
Veronica (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:02AM EST (link)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Pray as if everything depends on God, and work as if everything depends on us. – St. Augustine
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With due respect, I disagree.
Lords86 (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:34AM EST (link)For a general understanding of my thoughts, I have posted at length, Keep America Safe Ad and Critics Both Miss the Mark. This issue is of particular interest to me because my college roommate, former Bush Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense, Cully Stimson, stepped into this briar’s patch about three years ago.
It is simply not accurate to state that the ad doesn’t ask the viewer to make the implicit leap that those who have represented the jihadists share those jihadist beliefs. It clearly does – the implication at the beginning of the ad, wherein Holder speaks of progressives of shared beliefs is specifically designed to invoke that subliminal thought and not all that subliminally, I might add. And, then labeling them, i.e. the specific attorneys involved as the “Al qaeda seven” is designed clearly to reinforce this implication.
This implication, despite some viewers desire to want “it to be so,” is, without anything more, mere speculation. Such speculation needlessly derides those that have served in this capacity, without any possibility that that they share the views of the jihadists they may represent.
Do I know this for a fact? Yes. I know for a fact that a very good friend of mine, who is Jewish and a partner with a very large Washington D.C. law firm, represented a muslim jihadist in the not too distant past, as his principal counsel. He is not one of the “Al qaeda seven” referenced in the ad, but by analogy, to somehow argue that my friend shared the jihadist’s contempt for Israel and the Jewish people is beyond silly.
The problem with the ad is that it invites this criticism needlessly. The problem with the criticism is that it avoids the real issue. The issue is ‘ethics.’
The issue about the identity of the attorneys, their prior work and their current work is that we, the American public (the DOJ’s client), are entitled to know these matters, as a matter of ‘ethics.’ Past representation in matters against the DOJ and then work for the DOJ require a determination concerning the presence or absence of ‘conflicts of interest.’ Again, in NO WAY am I asserting that there are any conflicts of interest, but the reason for the disclosure is to assure the client, the American public, of this point. (And, in all likelihood, there is no ethics/conflict issue at all and we can all move on.)
This issue is what the ad should have emphasized, but instead obscured, and this issue is what the criticsim of the ad conveniently avoids.
Of course I meant "briarpatch."
Lords86 (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:37AM EST (link)The absence of an edit function on these comments gets me every time.
We have a right to know who is working for the US government.
Old_Crow (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 11:00AM EST (link)Actions have consequences and perhaps the Al Qaeda 7 should have given some thought how their reckless decision to represent these terrorists are going to echo through their lives for the next few decades.
We need to know who they are.
What cases they worked on.
Every opinion they wrote.
And what they are doing now at the DOJ.
In all likelihood, there are serious ethics conflicts here, and we will not be able to determine the extent of the problem until we have 100% disclosure.
“Enlightened statesmen will not always be at the helm.” — James Madison
Did you read my post?
Lords86 (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 12:34PM EST (link)I have said, now for a third time, that the issue is ethics and making a conflict of interest determination, through full disclosure.
But, let me disabuse you and others of some incorrect beliefs – the “al qaeda 7 should have given some thought how their reckless decision to represent these terrorists. . . ” In all likelihood, these attorneys didn’t choose anything. They were assigned (as third or fourth year associates) by their superiors to work on a file to assist (on a pro bono basis) with appointed counsel in the filing of a brief or the review of a motion.
To argue and pound the table that these people have made a “reckless” decision that will echo through their lives seems to me to be the height of hyperbole.
And, as to the assumption that there are serious conflicts here, how do you know? That’s the point of the need for disclosure – we don’t know.
Let’s assume as a third year associate, I review a brief on behalf of a jihadist defendant. Then, years later, I go to work for the DOJ in their Securities Division, examining SEC filings by a computer company owner here in Michigan.
Is there a legal conflict of interest? No, not even close.
Where the ad goes wrong is that it impliedly impugns the lawyers – I disagree with Erick – without attacking the real issue – the need for disclosure to eliminate the legitimate concerns that I, you and others may have over potential conflicts in the absence of clarifying information.
"5" to you Lords86
togaman Wednesday, March 10th at 11:09PM EST (link)Of course, you are raining on a very fun parade of painting members of the Obama DOJ as terrorist sympathizers, which makes you a spoilsport around here, but your arguments are quite sound. I eagerly await a logical detailed rebuttal to your post.
The Jihadi's lawyers were/are all concentrated in a few law firms.
realskinny (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 10:49AM EST (link)Not just those actively working to free the detainees but any lawyer employed by these firms should be disqualified from DOJ work on these cases. That would include Holder himself, of course, since his firm provided free aid to captured Terrorists.
As for those who defend these attorneys “changing sides”, how would you like to be charged with a crime, have a court appointed attorney, come into court a year later and see your former attorney or his partner sitting at the table with the prosecution? It is absolutely indefensible for anyone involved with defending these people to be within a mile of the DOJ handling their cases.
Liz Cheney for President./nt
Veronica (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 5:35PM EST (link)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Pray as if everything depends on God, and work as if everything depends on us. – St. Augustine
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5's to that
fpete13527 (Diary) Wednesday, March 10th at 5:43PM EST (link)I love Liz.
The Transparent Presidency??
ncmike Thursday, March 11th at 2:37PM EST (link)What happened to all the promises of transparecy?? Educated Americans make decisions based on information, but their pre-conceived, stereotypical, FEELINGS. Liz Cheney is simply raising the question of transparency, that was FIRST RAISED by Obama in the election. Why all the secrecy in a free country? The backgrounds and ideologies of UNELECTED federal employees charged is critical to how they will proceed fulfilling the duties of their office. The smell of this secrecy is telling. The smell of secrecy permeated the unquestioning media regarding the associations of Obama with Jeremiah Wright, Bill Ayers, Tony Rezko, Frank Marshall, Van Jones, and the list goes on. Where is the transparency that was preached and promoted in the campaign?