I wish I was a member of Saddleback. I would publicly resign because of this travesty.

The elders should be ashamed that they would allow something like this under the roof of their church.

After severely damaging the Evangelical church community with his awful “Purpose Driven” blather, now he’s moving to politics. Beware. In his books, he twists and distorts the Scriptures to meet his needs, picking the translation that says what he wants it to say, much like the Leftists do with the Constitution and the laws of the land.

Anyone who couldn’t see this coming with Warren was not paying attention all along. He’s even more dangerous than Jim Wallis and his ilk…at least they pretty much wear their Leftist allegiances on their sleeves. Warren does not, and he has millions of lemmings Purpose-Driven acolytes followers will be marching right along with him, perhaps not realizing where they’re headed.

must have had previous engagements.

On target, as usual, Erik.

I also agree with your comment about the Chicago Tribune’s story in light of the coming event.

I would also wonder aloud if the push to try and sell the story that “Republicans are leaving in droves for Obama” timing may also be tied to this week end’s event.

Sure, I could be wrong and that idea could be full of tin foil.

The caveat would be that we all understand that with marketing campaigns timing is everything.

Look for these events to be channeled into the upcoming DNC convention.

I have been worried about this forum and worried that Warren has gone leftist. This only seems to confirm my fears. The best spin you could put on it is that, in wanting to appear politically neutral, Warren has allowed his agenda to be dictated by the left.

Having said all that, this should be an opportunity for to highlight conservative answers to the usual leftist social policies like education and poverty.

On education, we need to emphasize school choice and what a waste the department of education is. School choice shouldn’t just be about better performance. It should also emphasize freedom of conscious. Government schools don’t just bar religious values, they actively work to undercut morals Christian parents are trying to teach their children.

On poverty, we should point out that the best cure for poverty is employment. You cannot improve employment if you are bashing and taxing the businesses that provide it. We also need to counter with the example of welfare reform and remind people that Democrats fought tooth and nail against it every step of the way.

This all brings me to my final worry. I have seen no sign that McCain can offer this type of defense. If he doesn’t he will either appear hard-hearted or like a me-too spender. I hope I am wrong about McCain. I want to be pleasantly surprised.

UCC’ers, Methodists, and Unitarian Universalists… couldn’t find room on the panel for, say, a Southern Baptist, a Missouri Synod Lutheran, or an Evangelical Covenant clergy member?

This is taking “liberal Christianity” to a whole new level. Hopefully what this does is further make an absurdity of a movement gasping for relevance, but something tells me that, instead, the MSM is going to fawn over this with the usual “You like me! You really like me!” tripe.

Oy.

Or has it been taped and you already saw it?

Here is their general information email for saddleback. Maybe they would appreciate some feedback.

info@saddleback.net

and publicize the Leftist control of this event everywhere he can.

Warren is pathetic.

Not one bit
I did not trust Rick Warren before and I trust him even less now (if that is possible)

This man is an embarrassment to Christianity

I am keenly aware that the Bible admonishes us to not speak against his people…..but the Bible also admonishes us to judge a tree ny its fruit…
Rick Warren…your fruit may look sweet but it is rotten

my question is this…Why has the McCain let McCain get locked into an obvious ambush?

The only answers we can com up with is that McCain and his campaign either agrees with this group, (which I doubt), or they are ignorant of Christian issues and concerns in politics that they’ve been duped, (which I believe is more likely).

Shame on Warren for his duplicity and dishonesty in setting this up…I don’t know what to say about the McCain Campaign.

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in Washington—Fred Thompson

unless he knew the types of questions he was going to be asked ahead of time.

Some won’t like what I have to say here, and this is just anecdotal evidence (my experience and observations), so take it for whatever it’s worth.

Saddleback is typical of the mega-churches today, and Rick Warren is typical of their leaders.

They’re big on contemporary, flashy, exciting, different, and new. They emphasize being relevant to today’s society. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, in and of itself.

What they lack is a good understanding of history, a solid foundation (e.g. Christian creeds), and strong accountability. This leads to a liberalization of doctrine and policy.

I for one, am not surprised by this event as are many others here. It’s exactly what I would expect from a church such as Saddleback.

As McCain allows himself to be offered up on the plate of “compromise” as is the foundation of Rick Warren and his “church”, then only good things can come from it, primarily the truth. For once, those who presently have a high esteem of both Mr. McCain and Mr. Warren, will clearly be able to see the “false prophet” in all three. Won’t hurt Obama one bit as his “believers” have already been locked down. I simply await to see how God is going to use this travesty to further His will.

Good point NightTwister. The mega-church phenomenon has weakened the church substantially over the last few years. I understand that Obama probably demanded that these people be involved as a condition for his participation, but it certainly indicates that we evangelicals won’t be hearing any response from him on the issues we care about most.

I really hope Warren will try to make up for the liberal influence with his own questions, but I’m not optimistic. He’s giving a sermon on Sunday designed to help his audience choose the right candidate in this election. I’ll be very interested to hear what he has to say after the forum.

that i have a feeling abortion and obamas live birth abortion is aok actions will be overshadowed by talk of family hope and his progressive redoing of his christianity. i know mccain is personal/private with his beliefs and i hope this doesnt look like obama showboats and speaks of which he doesnt truly believe in the word of. his previous interviews and statements of ‘sin is what goes against his beliefs’ and all religions are the same philosphy is just wrong or at least be exposed as what he really thinks.

Shameless promotion, in part, but also apropos.

http://www.redstate.com/diaries/gamecock/2008/aug/14/non-imposing-christian-evangelical-land-heali/

Mornin’ all (I’m a west-coaster). I’m sure I’ll be berated for chiming in, given that I’m one of those Christians who happens to be a liberal (go ahead, start thinking of your rebuttals), but I’d like to remind you all that Rick Warren, though he might not be as ideologically pure as you’d prefer, has turned the hearts and minds of millions toward Christ. I’ll say that i’m not a fan of program oriented Christianity, and I’m not a big fan of Purpose-Driven Life, but it’s got it’s purpose and God is using it to draw people to himself, so I’ve got no qualms with it.

Someone said his fruit might be sweet but it’s rotten. That’s quite ignorant of you to say, as if you know Warren’s heart and the spiritual state of all those who’ve come to know the Lord at Saddleback and through his book. I’d say the fruit is quite bountiful and we should praise God that one of his children has been given such influence that he can host an event with both presidential candidates (neither of which hold up under intense fundamentalist scrutiny if you’d be honest with yourselves. I won’t forget the bitter words of Dobson toward McCain) to discuss faith issues (it might not be as caustic a debate as some of you would hope, but it’s pretty public and i doubt that it’ll be as hollow as you assume), an event that will receive national attention.

Warren’s ministry is undeniably fruitful and I’d like to remind you that a believer doesnt have to have the pro-life agenda as the sole framework of his civic efforts (Lord knows we have plenty of those) to be doing God’s work in the world. There are dozens of other biblical issues to tackle, like combating poverty. Jesus kind of made that a huge deal, and Warren’s propping up of the environmental (rising ocean levels will effect the poor more than anyone else) and the poverty reduction movement is admirable. He’s taken a generous percentage of the wealth God has given him through that book and turned it into real life change. You have to admire that.

I don’t expect a single one of you to agree with me, but I hope you’ll at least temper your judgment of someone who has done a lot of good for the kingdom (a fool’s hope, but one can wish)

Tear away at me now, good Christians. It’s your ordained purpose.

Just attempting to match the tone of the discussion;)

Skepticism is one thing. (Lord knows I’m skeptical of everybody in public life. The Word tells us to put no trust in princes.) Questioning the efficacy of someone’s ministry despite all the evidence to the contrary of good is something different. Warren deserves to be defended.

Woa, people. I thought we were a little more thoughtful and fair-minded than this.

How about letting the debate actually take place before we judge and condemn Rick Warren? There’s a whole lot of assuming going on here by people, and imho it’s only making the assumer look foolish and small-minded.

Some of the bashing he’s recieving here is astounding. I know Warren to be a very graceful Christ-follower who does his best to live his faith in authenticity. He’s a genuine man, with no pretention, and is the exact opposite of the kind of tele-evangelist stereotype that too often gets played up in the media as an example of what a Christian pastor is today.

If he blows it on the debate, then it’s fair to look at his performance with a critical eye. But let it actually take place before you cast your stone at the man. Hopefully all of you skeptics will be surprised.

..so many liberal church groups (not just in the political sense, but much worse the theological liberal sense), Warren has demonstrated that he is more about self promotion than sound classical Christianity. People that drool at his books may think of him as great, but I would strongly urge you to look at some of the groups that Erick lists in his articles.

If you have read or listened to some of their positions, you would find them scripturaly repugnant (ranging from pro-choice, to opposing the divinity of the Christ).

Thanks to Erick for bringing this to our attention.

1. The person who answered the phone had no clue about the candidates forum.

2. She had no clue that he was not allowing questions on abortion.

3. She suggested I drop Pastor Warren an email:
   pastorrick@saddleback.net

monogamy and abstinence before marriage to retain any credibility.

Period.

Tomorrow is the gauntlet, more for Warren and the emerging Church movement than it is for McCain or Obama.

McCain is going to beat Obama handily in November, but the larger question is America Slouching Towards Gomorrah, and Warren’s movement is more critical to that question, even than Obama.

You see Erick, after Warren’s event, Gamecock will be tougher than anyone.

The bottom line is that there’s a ton of pre-judging and bashing going on here of a good Christian pastor. It’s the kind of stuff I’d expect to see at Kos or another far-left blog, not RedState. They hate Rick Warren. Weird to see that kind of rhetoric here too.

I’m the most pro-life person I know, but I’m not going to flame the man just because he potentially got the opinions of men who are not pro-life for the event. He probably consulted a plethora of people. If Warren blows it during the debate, it’s fair to question or criticize him. But let the debate actually happen first, then judge him on the actual merits of the job he did.

According to a CBN News interview with Rick Warren, he will address it all:

“I’m going to ask them about abortion. I am going to ask them about the definition of marriage,” he said. “I intend to ask the tough questions, but I am going to ask them in a civil way.

And he plans to ask both of them about Jesus Christ.

“I’m certainly going to ask a question about Jesus Christ in this forum,” he told CBN News. “No doubt about it.”

Anyway, I agree that one should not jump to conclusions too fast. Warren still does not seem half as bad as mega-church “evangelical” Joel Hunter and his Northland Church in Florida.

Regardless, I think this whole “interview” (or whatever you call it) is totally inappropriate for any pastor, especially with a church the size of Rick Warren’s. If he wants to interview candidates, he should become a talk show host or news reporter.

Time for a plate of crow:

Turns out GC was right to urge us to wait till the debate happened before criticizing Warren. I was pleasantly surprised at the even handed treatment of each candidate and the informative nature of the format.

Some of you will also be pleased to know I can now say president McCain without having a bucket handy to catch the spew…I was genuinely impressed with his answers…let’s just hope he keeps his AGW, and Immigration positions to himself through November!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in Washington—Fred Thompson